[May 2013..Dec 2013] The Gauteng E-tolling Thread

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DreamKing said:
non-compliance won't make sanral to collapse.

vote out the fuking anc is the only solution.
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How will non-compliance not collapse the system?
ANC will be in government for the next five years at the very least... so something else has to give.
 
DreamKing said:
non-compliance won't make sanral to collapse.

vote out the fuking anc is the only solution.
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I didn't say it WILL collapse. I said there is a greater chance that it MIGHT collapse.
But the point of my post was to say, it hasn't collapsed yet in Portugal, so don't expect it to collapse here within 3 months.
It may take a lot longer, and it may never collapse.
 
Garyvdh said:
I didn't say it WILL collapse. I said there is a greater chance that it MIGHT collapse.
But the point of my post was to say, it hasn't collapsed yet in Portugal, so don't expect it to collapse here within 3 months.
It may take a lot longer, and it may never collapse.
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Sanral's pickle is that the government can't bail them out of their bond obligations and they need a healthy debtors book to secure cash flow sufficient to repay the debt. Pretty sure the guarantor of a bond cannot make the payment without triggering a default.

Perhaps IzZzy can shed some light? I recall similar clauses used in Europe...
 
DJ... said:
Sanral's pickle is that the government can't bail them out of their bond obligations and they need a healthy debtors book to secure cash flow sufficient to repay the debt. Pretty sure the guarantor of a bond cannot make the payment without triggering a default.

Perhaps IzZzy can shed some light? I recall similar clauses used in Europe...
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As Government is the sole shareholder of Sanral, they would just give Sanral the funds via equity finance and avoid the whole direct payment mess.

The pickle is not that the Gov cannot bail them out (because that's precisely why there is a guarantee in place) but more because of the ramifications which will arise if they do i.e. it would mean Sanral faces a liquidity issue (possibly solvency too), which would mean a steep ratings cut.
 
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Tander said:
I think that is irrelevant. Having such a device on your car means intent I believe and that is the argument they will use.
Does anyone know if the cameras used are sensitive to infrared LEDs (High powered ones, maybe?)

Harder to spot them and car plates look stock?
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That's like saying they can arrest you for owning a gun. They can't. If you use it to shoot someone, then that changes completely.

Irrelevant as I'm never getting an e-tag and I'm not paying a cent. They can get bent.
 
IzZzy said:
As Government is the sole shareholder of Sanral, they would just give Sanral the funds via equity finance and avoid the whole direct payment mess.

The pickle is not that the Gov cannot bail them out (because that's precisely why there is a guarantee in place) but more because of the ramifications which will arise if they do i.e. it would mean Sanral faces a liquidity issue (possibly solvency too).
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Ag, true. But that would have a serious impact on pricing. Imagine the yield curve if they had to start doing so. It is tacit acknowledgement of a pending default. As it is there's no real secondary market for Sanral bonds...
 
DJ... said:
Ag, true. But that would have a serious impact on pricing. Imagine the yield curve if they had to start doing so. It is tacit acknowledgement of a pending default. As it is there's no real secondary market for Sanral bonds...
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As it already stands, I can only imagine the heavy negotiations SANRAL face each day for each contractor they intend appointing to maintain a particular road and the complex indemnities, gross ups, failure to launch punitive contractual provisions that are being pushed through to counter any possible public resistance. Well, that's what I would be doing if I were acting for a contractor to SANRAL. Funny, that's exactly the line of work my GF is in. Even though she can neither confirm nor deny, I said if she was involved in e-tolls then I'd need to seriously reconsider our relationship brief ;)
 
Tander said:
How will non-compliance not collapse the system?
ANC will be in government for the next five years at the very least... so something else has to give.
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anc will use the taxpayers' money to fund sanral up until no more taxes can be collected from the people.
anc put "a lot of" "investment" for the etoll. anc can't let it to collapse. NEVER!!!!
 
DreamKing said:
anc will use the taxpayers' money to fund sanral up until no more taxes can be collected from the people.
anc put "a lot of" "investment" for the etoll. anc can't let it to collapse. NEVER!!!!
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No it doesn't work that way...
 
E-tolls will not cost us votes – ANC

http://www.humanipo.com/news/34093/e-tolls-will-not-cost-us-votes-anc/

The African National Congress (ANC) Gauteng caucus is confident the e-tolling of the province’s freeways will not cost them votes in next year’s general elections.

According to a report by South African Broadcasting Corporation (SABC) News, analysts have predicted e-tolling may cost the ANC middle class votes in Gauteng.

Aside from e-tolls, Brian Hlongwa, the ANC chief whip in the Gauteng legislature, said there are other important issues the governing party is addressing.

“The constituency of the ANC, the majority of it is ordinary people, it is poor people whose lives are being improved,” SABC News quoted Hlongwa as saying. “People want access to clean water, to sanitation, to electricity. They want the healthcare system to work. They want jobs, they want skills and the ANC is responding to those issues.”

According to Hlongwa the majority he referred to will remain with the ANC if it addresses the service delivery problems.

Regarding the controversial e-tolling system, Hlongwa said: “The disenchantment is real, there are people who are unhappy with e-tolling.

E-tolling is set for implementation before the end of this year, said Dipuo Peters, who is also of the opinion most Gauteng motorists support e-tolling. She has urged road users in the province to register with the South African National Roads Agency Limited (SANRAL) and purchase an e-tag following president Jacob Zuma’s signing of the Transport Laws and Related Matters Bill into law.

Thus far, 608,000 vehicles have been e-tagged, 6,800 of which belong to the Gauteng government.

The e-toll tariffs were recently published in the Government Gazette and the Department of Transport (DoT) has invited the public to comment.

However, those wishing to do so through the DoT’s website (transport.gov.za) are unable to do so due to a “bad gateway” technical error rendering the site inaccessible. The DoT has been experiencing this problem since yesterday.
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Public being misled on Tolls: DA

Johannesburg - The government is misleading the public about the cost of e-tolls, the DA charged on Thursday.

“It is hard to believe that more than 80 percent of users carrying an e-tag will pay only R100 maximum per month,” Democratic Alliance Gauteng premier candidate Mmusi Maimane said in a statement.

According to the Government Gazette on e-toll tariffs published on Wednesday, 82.7 percent of road users (Class A2) would pay a maximum of R100 a month if they were registered as e-tag users.

The DA said a driver travelling from Daveyton to Johannesburg would pass through at least five gantries on a return trip, at an approximate cost of R13.92 a day. This amounted to R69.60 in a five-day week, and R278.40 a month.

On Wednesday, the Supreme Court of Appeal dismissed an Opposition to Urban Tolling Alliance appeal against the implementation of e-tolls by the SA National Roads Agency Limited (Sanral).

The DA said travelling between Alexandra and Centurion, a user would pass through at least six gantries at an approximate cost of R17.31 a day, R86.55 a week, and R346.20 a month.

From Soweto to Midrand, a driver would pass through at least 11 gantries on a return trip, at an approximate cost of R29.64 a day, and would reach the threshold of R400 a month.

For a commute between Tembisa and Germiston, a motorist would pass through at least four gantries on a return trip, at an approximate cost of R14.40 a day, R72 a week, and R288 a month.

Maimane said Government Communication and Information Service acting CEO Phumla Williams's remarks about e-tolls at a Cabinet briefing on Thursday showed how out of touch the government was with Gauteng residents.

“Her appeal for people to show good citizenship and pay for e-tolling is a slap in the face of ordinary South Africans who struggle to get by on a daily basis.”

Maimane vowed to put a stop to the process if elected premier of Gauteng.

Earlier, at the SA Chamber of Commerce and Industry's (SACCI) annual convention, Transport Minister Dipuo Peter said: The politicisation of e-tolls, specifically the user-pays principle, did not help anyone.

“It doesn't help us to play politics with infrastructure development,” she said.

- Sapa
 
Cleric: E-tolls will lead to violence

http://www.iol.co.za/motoring/indus...-will-lead-to-violence-1.1590417#.Ulf3GxAj65I

South African church leaders have expressed concern that if e-tolling goes ahead, violence could result.

In a press conference held on Thursday following the Supreme Court of Appeal’s judgment in favour of e-tolling, the Opposition to Urban Tolling Alliance, church leaders and the QuadPara Association of SA said it was now up to society if they wanted to express their opposition to e-tolls.
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Ah I see we're doing this the African way...

Bring it on I say. South Africans at every level need to fight these tolls. Not just OUTA.
 
Middle class South African's need to take a page out of the labour class' playbook for once. Get down and dirty with a proper protest. Bring Gauteng to a grinding halt. Highly unlikely though.
 
Tander said:
How will non-compliance not collapse the system?
ANC will be in government for the next five years at the very least... so something else has to give.
Click to expand...

What system do you want to collapse though.

Sanral has borrowed money from a lot of different places, you don't actually know what the end result could be.
 
I will practice good citizenship when the ANC practices good governance.
 
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