on road handling fees

OTRF is money making for the dealers. I fill my own petrol. License my own cars. And buy the mats I want at far more competitive prices.
When I go on to buy a car, I'm not interested in anything else.

And I haven't met an honest car dealer, yet.
 
Yeah... I won't listen to excuses for the scam that is on the road fees, and it seems neither will most of the other posters :rolleyes:
 
Fazda said:
And you missed the part where I was talking about a Subaru with a 65 litre tank - my figures relate to Subaru and the costs involved in getting it on the road - not a Materia or a Fazda bakkie.

I am also not talking about topping a tank up - cars arrive with literally enough gas in them to drive off the transporter and into the PDI bay before running out of fuel - our 65 litre tank, when filled to the brim actually takes closer to 70 litres, and that's what we pay for - even so, let's say that the manufacturer was generous and we only had to put 60 litres into the tank - it is still 12.83 x 60 = R 769.80, which is almost 100% more than the R 400 that you quote.

You also studiously ignore the fact that a business is supposed to be run at a profit, and I am so, so tired of trying to correct people on this forum, when they go on and on about the massive profits that the "stealers" make - they don't.

Our dealership costs R 1.2 million/month just to open the front doors - we are not a bunch of thieves rolling around in our gold at the end of the month - this is the real world, and in the real world, businesses cost money to run....we are NOT Non Profit Organisations, and it's time people started realising that.

If you don't want to pay dealer prices then don't buy from dealers, and learn to service your own car and buy cars on Gumtree. I really don't care - just get off the soap box - it won't change a thing.
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Explain why i can get cars in the US or UK for half the price and twice the features. You stealerships are theives down here cause not a single person can explain that. the only non rational excuse is that "oh, the states sells more cars". but what about the UK where some of the cars are made, they come down here with half the features and still twice the cost.

yes, i am pissed off about this as it just doesn't make sense to me. is it taxes or what?
 
crackersa said:
Explain why i can get cars in the US or UK for half the price and twice the features. You stealerships are theives down here cause not a single person can explain that. the only non rational excuse is that "oh, the states sells more cars". but what about the UK where some of the cars are made, they come down here with half the features and still twice the cost.

yes, i am pissed off about this as it just doesn't make sense to me. is it taxes or what?
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Think the reason was government taxation that results in us being shafted the way we are....
 
Yeah. It is because of government tax, so crackersa's anger is slightly misdirected... Except with locally manufactured cars. Their prices are adjusted up, to not undercut the heavily taxed imported cars too much. Right Fazda?
 
so 100% tax on imported cars? and that just doesn't make sense on the locally made cars. i wouldn't say it was pushed up to not undercut but because people are willing to pay that.

if the public stops paying these ridiculousness prices then they will drop. and the public needs to have a massive outcry about the 100% taxes.
 
crackersa said:
so 100% tax on imported cars? and that just doesn't make sense on the locally made cars. i wouldn't say it was pushed up to not undercut but because people are willing to pay that.

if the public stops paying these ridiculousness prices then they will drop. and the public needs to have a massive outcry about the 100% taxes.
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100%? Where do you get that figure? I speak under correction, but I think it's something like 40%.
 
Quantum Theory said:
100%? Where do you get that figure? I speak under correction, but I think it's something like 40%.
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Depends.

AFAIK: Last time I checked it was something between 0-40-70% ... ignoring any possible stacking of course (VAT is probably charged on the total amount of taxes as well). The different taxes starts off with the 20-36% custom duties, then the 0-20% Ad valorem duties and then lastly the 14% VAT. Only immigrating residents for example can score the 0% tax rate as they get a full rebate on all of it.
 
Quantum Theory said:
100%? Where do you get that figure? I speak under correction, but I think it's something like 40%.
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ok, not exactly 100% but the difference in options will show that someone is coining it somewhere. i chose entry level cars per model to compare on an exchange rate of 8.5 (to keep it constant)

Ford Focus RSA - 1.6 Ambiente 4 door - R218,900 ($25,752)
Fird Focus US -Focus S Sedan (2.0lt) - $16,995 (R144,457.50) and it's a 2.0lt!!!
Ford Focus US - Focus SE 5-Door (2.0lt) - $19,995 (R169,957.50) and its a 2.0lt!!!

VW
Golf 2.5l 4d (US entry level) $19,995 -R169,957.50
Golf 1.2 TSI Trendline Manual (RSA entry level, RSA only goes up to a 1.4lt) - R233,800 - $27505
edit -- did find 2.0 VW Golf R282,300 - $33,211 (which you can buy a BMW in the states for this price)

BMW
320i RSA - R361,000 - $42,470
320i US $32,550 - R276,675
 
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Have you looked at the exchange rate recently? 8.5?

Also, it would help if you compare cars with the exact same specs. If you give me a minute, I'll find an example or two... The following link says import duties are around 36% + ad valorem up to 20% + 14% VAT

http://southafrica.angloinfo.com/transport/vehicle-ownership/duties-taxes/

The government is taking your money... Nothing new.
 
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@crackersa - please calm down and start thinking this through rationally - my God if the Dealerships were able to control car prices in SA you would have a chaotic runaround of everyone trying to undercut the guy next door - come on!!

The price of cars in SA is dictated by TAXES - if we look at an imported car - the price is calculated by cost price in the country of origin, add to that, shipping costs, and your car lands in SA - NOW the BIG add takes place, as the government takes its slice of the pie - for example a Subaru Outback will land here for a touch over 300k - retail is 410 000 - the difference is entirely in the form of taxes - paraplegics can buy a new Subaru excluding all taxes except VAT and they save in the region of 100k per car.

Please don't go ranting a load of cr@p about something which obviously know nothing about.

Import Duties and Taxes
Information about the duties and taxes payable on vehicles imported to South Africa…

Import duty and VAT
Vehicles are subject to import duty and VAT, although some people may be exempt from these charges, depending on their circumstances. Customs duty of 36 percent may be payable on a vehicle less than 20 years old. Vehicles over 20 years old are subject to 20 percent customs duty. Ad valorem duty is applied on a sliding scale, depending on the value of the vehicle, with a minimum of 0.75 percent and a maximum of 20 percent.

VAT is currently charged on all duties at 14 percent.

A rebate may be applicable for one vehicle per household for returning residents and immigrants (conditions apply). Returning residents wanting to qualify for a rebate of customs duty must be able to prove that they owned the vehicle for more than 12 months prior to import.
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Please note that the above taxes do not include other little government add on's, such as CO2 tax, just as an example. The people who are "exempt" would be the paraplegics that I mentioned before.
 
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Fazda said:
@crackersa - please calm down and start thinking this through rationally - my God if the Dealerships were able to control car prices in SA you would have a chaotic runaround of everyone trying to undercut the guy next door - come on!!

The price of cars in SA is dictated by TAXES - if we look at an imported car - the price is calculated by cost price in the country of origin, add to that, shipping costs, and your car lands in SA - NOW the BIG add takes place, as the government takes its slice of the pie - for example a Subaru Outback will land here for a touch over 300k - retail is 410 000 - the difference is entirely in the form of taxes - paraplegics can buy a new Subaru excluding all taxes except VAT and they save in the region of 100k per car.

Please don't go ranting a load of cr@p about something which obviously know nothing about.



Please note that the above taxes do not include other little government add on's, such as CO2 tax, just as an example. The people who are "exempt" would be the paraplegics that I mentioned before.
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This is massively below the belt, but I reckon we all need to befriend paraplegics and get them to buy cars for us...
 
Fazda said:
Did you read anything that I said at all, or have you simply closed down?
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Yip, I closed down because I don't buy the BS on the road fees....

Can't wait till Pick n pay advertise chicken for R60 and when you get to the till they want another R6 for the packaging it's in.
 
xrapidx said:
Yip, I closed down because I don't buy the BS on the road fees....

Can't wait till Pick n pay advertise chicken for R60 and when you get to the till they want another R6 for the packaging it's in.
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Yip - and you chose to ignore the fact that we DO NOT charge between 5000 and 6000 for OTRF.

Do you enjoy perpetuating a lie?

Talk about BS!
 
I didn't say you did, but trhere are dealerships who do, as posted by ANOTHER poster.. Do you enjoy making up your own BS?

Seems you're the one wanting to lie. :rolleyes:
 
xrapidx said:
I didn't say you did, but trhere are dealerships who do, as posted by ANOTHER poster.. Do you enjoy making up your own BS?

Seems you're the one wanting to lie. :rolleyes:
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Amazing - one dealership charges ridiculous fees so we are ALL to blame. :rolleyes:

Why would I want to lie? You seem to be making an art of it, right now.
 
Yeh I lied... All of it was a lie, only one dealership in SA rips off clients. :rolleyes:

I just dawned on me I'm attempting to argue with a car salesman... What a waste of my time.
 
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Quantum Theory said:
Have you looked at the exchange rate recently? 8.5?

Also, it would help if you compare cars with the exact same specs. If you give me a minute, I'll find an example or two... The following link says import duties are around 36% + ad valorem up to 20% + 14% VAT

http://southafrica.angloinfo.com/transport/vehicle-ownership/duties-taxes/

The government is taking your money... Nothing new.
Click to expand...

ummm..it really doesn't matter what exchange rate i used, i just wanted to show the constant variable. and wasn't it 8.5 not to long ago? showing it at 9.5 will just show a bigger gap.
 
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