Racial Classification

[Xarog]

Your president as well by your definition. So what's your point?

He doesn't have a point. He's deluded by a false sense of self-entitlement.

 

[Capetonian688]

Classification based on race is racism.

How do you know that? Wikipedia defines Racism:
"Racism is a belief or doctrine that differences in physical appearance between people (such as those upon which the concept of race is based) determine cultural or individual achievement, and usually involve the idea that one's own 'race' is superior."

Race classification is nothing like the above. It is pure administrative classification. It is a formality. What follows on it, is BEE and AA, explained below:

Only physically acting upon, or discriminating based on race, without prior reason (e.g. to be able to correct the wrongs of the past), is wrong. BEE and AA today are somewhat like the racial segregation acts during Apartheid, only difference is, BEE and AA today are justified because it attemps to correct the wrongs of Apartheid.

 

[Capetonian688]

Your president as well by your definition. So what's your point?

Africans could not vote for a party that would give us our president of choice. Anyway, my point was that De Klerk admitted that Apartheid was wrong, so it is nonsense that there was still some admission of guilt, of Apartheid, pending of any sort.

 

[Capetonian688]

He doesn't have a point. He's deluded by a false sense of self-entitlement.

Can us Africans maybe just have a small part of South Africa? Can we maybe just get a few houses, hospitals and schools? Are we entitled to that at least? Thank you.

 

[Xarog]

Africans could not vote for a party that would give us our president of choice.

Niether could under 18s.

Anyway, my point was that De Klerk admitted that Apartheid was wrong, so it is nonsense that there was still some admission of guilt, of Apartheid, pending of any sort.

Well I admitted that everyone born in africa is an idiot. I must be right, right?

 

[Nick333]

The likelyhood that non-Africans will be able to bring to leg a political party that can pass a bill to change the classification terminology, is so extremely miniscule small, that for me, it is as good as saying "nothing can be done about it"!

Well it wouldn't require a majority in parliament if it were found to be discriminatory in a court of law. But its interesting that you have so little faith in our democracy.

 

[Xarog]

Can us Africans maybe just have a small part of South Africa? Can we maybe just get a few houses, hospitals and schools? Are we entitled to that at least? Thank you.

Note the 'false' sense of entitlement. A true sense of entitlement includes : a reasonable opportunity to be employed, access to proper healthcare, opportunity to aquire housing, a decent education.

Funny how 1,2,3 AND 4 are being ignored by the ANC, and instead we have this AA/BEE nonsense shoved down our throats. And what's worse, you defend it while ignoring the real issues that people desperately need to be addressed.

As I said, the ANC only cares about its self-enrichment rather than actually running the country justly. And you're nothing but a despicable toady for towing the party line.

 

[Capetonian688]

Well it wouldn't require a majority in parliament if it were found to be discriminatory in a court of law. But its interesting that you have so little faith in our democracy.

For pete's sake, then go and lodge a case at the High Court and put forward that the classification "African" and "non-African" is discriminatory! Why moan about it here on an internet forum?

On the contrary, I have a lot of faith in our democracy - we have come a long way since Apartheid.

 

[Debbie]

ahem, i repeat, i wish to be considered a black african in the eyes of the law - prove me wrong

 

[Capetonian688]

Note the 'false' sense of entitlement. A true sense of entitlement includes : a reasonable opportunity to be employed, access to proper healthcare, opportunity to aquire housing, a decent education.

Funny how 1,2,3 AND 4 are being ignored by the ANC, and instead we have this AA/BEE nonsense shoved down our throats. And what's worse, you defend it while ignoring the real issues that people desperately need to be addressed.

As I said, the ANC only cares about its self-enrichment rather than actually running the country justly. And you're nothing but a despicable toady for towing the party line.

Come on, be realistic.
These 4 amenities you mention are not being provided to Africans today, not because the ANC government aren't doing their best to provide it (I think they are trying pretty hard), but because of RIFE RACISM (against Africans) in the public sectors that are supposed to provide these amenities!

There are still way too many non-Africans, sitting in key positions, that are trying hard to stun any African growth in the personnel positions of those sectors! BEE and AA will sort this out, however, so it is only a matter of time before Africans get the positions they deserve in those crucial positions and roles, in order to provide a better life for all.

 

[Capetonian688]

ahem, i repeat, i wish to be considered a black african in the eyes of the law - prove me wrong

Is your skin white? If so, then by law, you cannot be classified as a black African, or African for that matter.
Note again that this is not discrimination or racism. It is a pure administrative formality. And needs to be correct.

 

[Nick333]

For pete's sake, then go and lodge a case at the High Court and put forward that the classification "African" and "non-African" is discriminatory! Why moan about it here on an internet forum?

On the contrary, I have a lot of faith in our democracy - we have come a long way since Apartheid.

I started this thread because of a post in another thread about how I should be classified as a European-African. I thought I'd move the discussion here instead of derailing the other thread.

But hell your right why try and debate anything on an internet forum. RPM should have taken his gripe with the Gov, the DOC and Telkom to court instead of wining on an internet forum. I'm sure your average lecturer has plenty of time and money to spend on litigation.

While we're at it why did you waste your time arguing BS points when you just had a problem with me voicing my opinion?

 

[icyrus]

There are statistically very few cases, compared with the national population as a whole, where mixed race children cause problems when it comes to classification. Certain sectors of the SA population love to refer to such cases as proof that classification based on race does not work, however they know full well that the vast majority of SA population are not mixed and can be easily classified. Skin colour is still the best way to classify people into African and non-African, thus previously advantaged or disadvantaged. There is no need for any special measures or any alternative method of classification on African vs non-African and thus advantaged or disadvantaged for such a small sample of the population that are individual mixed cases.

Your racism and outright support of racist policies are spine chilling. I would have thought that here, of all countries, we would be able to see the danger in this.

I guess I expected too much of my fellow humans.

 

[Capetonian688]

I started this thread because of a post in another thread about how I should be classified as a European-African. I thought I'd move the discussion here instead of derailing the other thread.

But hell your right why try and debate anything on an internet forum. RPM should have taken his gripe with the Gov, the DOC and Telkom to court instead of wining on an internet forum. I'm sure your average lecturer has plenty of time and money to spend on litigation.

While we're at it why did you waste your time arguing BS points when you just had a problem with me voicing my opinion?

I had no problem with you voicing your opinion. I was merely explaining that the SA government had already decided who's African and who's non-African. My "BS" points, as you call it, was intended as supportive reasoning on my explanation. And do not tell me I waste my time, or insinuate that I have problems with anyone voicing their opinions. You are clearly trying to build up ammonution in a vain attempt to get me into trouble. Do not put words in my mouth or make assumptions on my side about wasting my time etc.

 

[Capetonian688]

Your racism and outright support of racist policies are spine chilling. I would have thought that here, of all countries, we would be able to see the danger in this.

I guess I expected too much of my fellow humans.

What racism? Point it out to me.
What support of racist policies? They are policies, not racist policies.

The fact that your accusations against me, are "spine-chilling" to you, does not make it any more true than if you would have mentioned it without the "spine-chilling" phrase. Neither does your statement of "fellow human expectations", compliment any truth to your accusations. Tell me I am a racist in my face straight, rather than to dolly it up with phrases like "spine-chilling" and "fellow human expectations" in the hope that the others who read this, will follow your lead in admiration of your dolly-up phrases.

 

[Xarog]

ahem, i repeat, i wish to be considered a black african in the eyes of the law - prove me wrong

Actually in accordance of the BEE act, all previously disadvantaged groups (women included) are 'black' in the eyes of the law. And you were born in Africa, so there you go.

Come on, be realistic.
These 4 amenities you mention are not being provided to Africans today, not because the ANC government aren't doing their best to provide it (I think they are trying pretty hard), but because of RIFE RACISM (against Africans) in the public sectors that are supposed to provide these amenities!

The state provides healthcare and education. It's the state education and healthcare system that's in shambles, not the 'public' health and education sectors.

Fix education and you fix the employment and housing problem. People who are too poor to afford houses need to be educated to the point where they can earn enough money to BUY their own house without needing a govt handout.

The so-called public sector can't do squat while the majority of the population can barely pass a literacy test.

There are still way too many non-Africans, sitting in key positions, that are trying hard to stun any African growth in the personnel positions of those sectors! BEE and AA will sort this out, however, so it is only a matter of time before Africans get the positions they deserve in those crucial positions and roles, in order to provide a better life for all.

Behold the racist finally showing his true colours.

 

[Capetonian688]

Behold the racist finally showing his true colours.

I am not the racist for explaining the statement. The racists are the non-Africans I refer to INSIDE of my statement. I merely made a statement of how it really is. Racism is based on discrimination, and the racist discrimination are performed by the non-Africans I refer to INSIDE of my statement. Do you get it?

 

[BobbyMac]

The K and N words, if I think I know what you mean, are derogative. The term "non-African" word is not derogative. If you believe it is, then it is a false perception created by yourself.

Bull****. I call my friends Niggaz all the time - and they me. When we are called it by white people it is not acceptable to us. It's a black thing.

Your so called democratic government classifies me as coloured. Really odd that, considering I was born and raised in the UK - where if anything I was referred to as Black. That would make me more European than most of you. Strange obsession you guys have with race. In any case, I ain't no African, and I would hate being called one considering where the continent is today. This is a really stupid gripe to have - let it go already. Really weird that it's mostly African people obsessed with their own identity. I wonder if it's that holding the continent back....

 

[icyrus]

What racism? Point it out to me.
What support of racist policies? They are policies, not racist policies.

The fact that your accusations against me, are "spine-chilling" to you, does not make it any more true than if you would have mentioned it without the "spine-chilling" phrase. Neither does your statement of "fellow human expectations", compliment any truth to your accusations. Tell me I am a racist in my face straight, rather than to dolly it up with phrases like "spine-chilling" and "fellow human expectations" in the hope that the others who read this, will follow your lead in admiration of your dolly-up phrases.

All that has been discussed here already. You are supportive of classifying people by race. You find great glee in the fact that the majority can press this discrimination onto the minority. So you must either be incredible short-sighted and foolish or a racist.

So you are much in favour of race-based classification? How about we take it further, what about eye colour and hair color? Why not those as well if we are going to differentiate and segregate people based on minor genetic alterations? And will you be regaling us with your delight at our democratic government's actions if they decided that now all people who are not African shouldn't be allowed to own property? Or walk in certain areas?

Will you be happy with new apartheid because this time you are on the benefiting side and you can happily tell us it is what the majority want?

As for my "dolly-up phrases", I was merely expressing my disgust that we could have gone through all of this terrible history and yet you seem to have learned absolutely nothing.

 

[Xarog]

I am not the racist for explaining the statement. The racists are the non-Africans I refer to INSIDE of my statement. I merely made a statement of how it really is. Racism is based on discrimination, and the racist discrimination are performed by the non-Africans I refer to INSIDE of my statement. Do you get it?

Yup. You assume that all whites are racists. That makes you a racist.