The Middle East Conflict Thread

Alan said:
Zimbabwe a democracy. Wow I never realised


Benign WTF :eek::eek:
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Thy embezzled millions of dollars meant as aid for their own people and you call them benign. QUOTE]

Yep -Zim is a democracy and the benign despot was hypothetical. I didn't link it to Zimbabwe or even the USA...
 
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Garyvdh said:
show me one place where you condemned the Palestinians.
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I've posted many times on the palestinian/israeli issue :-

Both sides are wrong, but I have a serious issue with Israel, the West, or Christianity painting themselves as snowy white and the other side pitch black.

That simply isn't the reality.

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I will never understand those who believe any long term solution can be found through violence.

And btw, the above refers to both sides,


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Sure they should have a homeland. Same as the Palestinians should have a homeland.

Problem is they both want the same land.
So unless they learn to play nicely and share their toys .....

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the ONLY peaceful way is to share, though if you listen to the jewish ultra-nationalists and fundamentalist zealots, the word "share" doesnt enter..

And so it will go on until extremists on both sides are sidelined.

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Read my posts - extremists on both sides are wrong. Both sides claim to be the victim. Both sides accuse the other of being the aggressor.
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I do not support violence from either side.

Nor do I support inhumane treatment of civilians.

Nor do I support arrogance from any country.

For the record - neither party holds any moral high ground in any way whatsoever.
 
Something I posted on another thread but which provides some perspective on who is getting the short end of the stick -

119 Israeli children have been killed by Palestinians and 982 Palestinian children have been killed by Israelis since September 29, 2000.

1,031 Israelis and at least 4,528 Palestinians have been killed since September 29, 2000.

During Fiscal Year 2007, the U.S. gave more than $6.8 million per day to Israel and $0.3 million per day to the Palestinians.

1 Israeli is being held prisoner by Palestinians, while 10,756 Palestinians are currently imprisoned by Israel.

Eye opening stuff no matter which side of the fence you are on.
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We will discuss this ad-nauseum and still disagree.

Personally I have had the choice I would destroy every zionist and every hamas zealot.

Then they may just have a chance of peace.
 
daveza said:
Something I posted on another thread but which provides some perspective on who is getting the short end of the stick -
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Clearly skewed - using your theory, Israel would only be justified in killing the same number of terrorists as their civilians that were killed, or maybe they should keep an arsenal of primitive weapons to use equal force against the aggressors - NOT - they go in and take out the terrorists bomb making factories, and it would help reduce the collateral damage if Hamas did not build these in civilian areas.
 
daveza said:
So a 10% failure rate is acceptable ? 10 bombs landed on non-military targets, ie civilian areas.

How many crappy Hamas rockets will need to be fired to even come close to the devastation those 10 bombs caused ?

To launch sophisticated weapons into a civilian area is just barbaric.

Read the condemnation coming from across the world - are they all wrong ?

Are there any countries supporting Israel in this atrocity ?
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It does not matter whether it is a crappy Hamas rocket, a nuke or a filed down spoon, both the Israelis and the Palestinians are guilty of the same thing i.e. killing civilians.
 
The problem is more disproportionate use of force. If all they took out was bombers etc you think the world would give a crap? The current death toll is >185

And yes i was watching this since early this week when Israel had the blockade on the strip up to apparently prevent munition from coming in(before the peace deal ended).. of cause this blocks aid as well. So yah, i was watching the incoming reports of bombings in Israel and guess what, not a single casualty occurred yet the Israeli response which has the latest high tech equipment kills so many and is justified?

I stick with what i always say, get most of the new 'immigrants' out of Israel, and reconcile? I doubt very much there would be problems if something similar to what happen in SA happen there. But alas its easier to slaughter, maim and basically occupy by allowing anyone to settle there just to displace the people such that they disappear.(reminds of US vs American indians)

While i don't condone terrorist actions, at times like this i won't be so harsh because what Israel is doing under the guise of state is deplorable.


<And because i know marine1 etc will bring up holocast, oh wait he already did lmao typical eh?>
 
Frankie said:
Clearly skewed .
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How can this be skewed ?

These are the figures whether anyone likes them or not.

I don't mind if nobody agrees with my take, but at least debate the facts.

And the facts show a huge dis proportionality in the deaths incurred.

Israel flew into Entebbe and rescued all but one hostage. Are we really expected to accept they cannot find a way to take out hamas leaders without bombing suburbs into rubble ?
 
daveza said:
How can this be skewed ?

These are the figures whether anyone likes them or not.

I don't mind if nobody agrees with my take, but at least debate the facts.

And the facts show a huge dis proportionality in the deaths incurred.

Israel flew into Entebbe and rescued all but one hostage. Are we really expected to accept they cannot find a way to take out hamas leaders without bombing suburbs into rubble ?
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Lesson learnt - don't build bomb factories in the suburbs.

The rockets are launched into sparsely populated areas of Israel and the terrorists bomb factories are built in the suburbs - of course the numbers of dead will be different, but that does not mean no action should be taken against the rocket launchers.
 
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Frankie said:
Odd how quiet this lot is when their terrorist buddies are suicide bombing others and the pallies firing their rockets into Israel.

SA Islamic groups condemned on Saturday the deadly Israeli air raids
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Typical.


krycor said:
The problem is more disproportionate use of force.
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What utter cr@p. If you hit me, dont expect me to kiss you, I will hit back and hit back harder and faster. This is for survival, we all know what Israel's neighbours are capable of and she has the right to use whatever force is necessary to stop these terrorists.
Thats the politically correct term used by the UH, what a joke. Fire a rocket into my backyard and I will send through a thousand. Dont complain when it happens as you were the one who asked for it.
 
daveza said:
How can this be skewed ?

These are the figures whether anyone likes them or not.

I don't mind if nobody agrees with my take, but at least debate the facts.

And the facts show a huge dis proportionality in the deaths incurred.

Israel flew into Entebbe and rescued all but one hostage. Are we really expected to accept they cannot find a way to take out hamas leaders without bombing suburbs into rubble ?
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Come on man, that was against a few soldiers at an airport, clearly there are more Palestinian terrorists to deal with than that as they all voted in Hamas. What must Israel go in silently and kill every single Hamas member by knife?
 
I think Israel's message is pretty clear; push us and we'll push you back. Seems fair to me.
 
Hamas reminds me of a little kid taunting a vicious dog and when the dog turns around and bites the little kids hand, the little kid goes crying to his mummy only to repeat the act the very next day and get bitten again.

The more things change the more they stay the same in this conflict, it's a perpetual tit for tat conflict that will never end. In fact the day the world finally ends the news headlines will read, "world leaders condemn senseless killing of Palestinian infant." And on the same page ''130million die of the coast of South America after 30metre Tsunami strikes''.

What Hamas fail to realize is no conclusion, other than a painful one, will be brought to fruition if they continue to taunt the vicious dog...
 
Ah yes "disproportionate force". The liberal MSM ( get your mind out the gutter Peter ffs) catch phrase when their poor freedom loving chums Hizbollah was on the receiving end a few years ago :o

Hamas should be thankful Israel doesn't flatten the entire place. It's well within their capabilities and you'd soon see a massive drop in rocket attacks. Instead the Israelis use restraint which puts their own citizens lives at risk. The propagandists then have the nerve to claim they're acting disproportionately. :eek:

Perhaps in the interests of a proportionate response Israel should just indiscriminately lob an artillery shell into Gaza for every rocket shot into Israel by Hamas instead of precision strikes. You'd get a worse casualty ratio as well as all the victims being innocent Palestinians :rolleyes:
 
marine1 said:
Ummm what has Apartheid got to do with Israel defending itself against terror? This is just typical PC talk from Cosatu, the only way they can get support, cry Apartheid crap.
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So you've never seen any stories linking what's going on in Israel with an apartheid type situation?
 
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