The Proteas - Our Team!

[bwana]

http://www.espncricinfo.com/england/content/story/1075718.html

EDIT: good edit

Thanks, I thought so too

 

[Neoprod]

[-]Four.[/-]

EDIT: my bad - I see it was increased to seven

http://icc-live.s3.amazonaws.com/cms/media/about_docs/523af0cd4a1db-Player%20Eligibility%20Rules%20-%20effective%2018%20September%202013.pdf



Not sure why the 3.2 and 3.3 are stipulated...but it looks like 4 years still applies.

These are rules effective September 2013.

 

[Speedster]

[-]Four.[/-]

EDIT: my bad - I see it was increased to seven

Correct. The ICC rule is 4, but ECB requires 7.

Source

 

[Neoprod]

The more I look at this Kolpak thing, the more unenforceable some of these rules look.

Thinking about soccer players playing in Europe under the same Kolpak ruling - none of them give up national representation to play in England (for example). How does the ECB get away with something the FA can't?

The FA have the same concerns about overseas players hindering the number of homegrown players in the top league so I would have thought if it was legal, they would have implemented a similar rule to make foreign players think twice about signing up with a Premier League club.

 

[Creag]

So the count is now 8 players who have represented the Proteas in one format or another are now signed out by Kolpak:

1. Kyle Abbott
2. Rilee Rossouw
3. Marchant de Lange
4. David Wiese
5. Simon Harmer
6. Colin Ingram
7. Stiann van Zyl
8. Hardus Viljoen

Grief!

Are there any more to come?

 

[sox63]

I see the selectors went for basically our SA A team for the T20 series with Sri Lanka.

Behardien (Captain)
JJ Smuts
Miller
De Bruyn
Tahir
Kuhn
Mosehle
Ngidi
Parnell
Dane Patterson
Phangiso
Phehlukwayo

 

[stefan9]

Sadly in cricket you can serve a time period and then represent another team. In football on the other hand if you play a competitive game even if it is at under age level that's it.

 

[Speedster]

Sadly in cricket you can serve a time period and then represent another team. In football on the other hand if you play a competitive game even if it is at under age level that's it.

Not quite true, Diego Costa being a prime example

 

[DanDango]

Sadly in cricket you can serve a time period and then represent another team. In football on the other hand if you play a competitive game even if it is at under age level that's it.

Not quite true, Diego Costa being a prime example

Fifa eligibility rules is not too bad, Icc eligibility rules not so much.

Article 7. Acquisition of a new nationality
He was born on the territory of the relevant Association;
His biological mother or biological father was born on the territory of the relevant Association;
His grandmother or grandfather was born on the territory of the relevant Association;
He has lived continuously for at least fi ve years after reaching the age of 18on the territory of the relevant Association.
This article shows the condition must be fulfilled so that the players can an association. Article 7 about acquisition of a new nationality is somewhat similar unless that the fourth point stated that the players has lived in the territory of relevant association for at least 5 years after his 18 birthday

Article 8. Change of Association
First paragraph states the eligibility of the players once he changed his nationality, which is quite similar to Article 5 second paragraph.
He has not played a match (either in full or in part) in an Official Competition at “A” international level for his current Association, and at the time of his first full or partial appearance in an international match in an Official Competition for his current Association, he already had the nationality of the representative team for which he wishes to play.
He is not permitted to play for his new Association in any competition in which he has already played for his previous Association.

The point is when you want to change nationalities from one to another, you need to have both nationalities when you represent one nation. For, Mikel Arteta, who was denied by FIFA to represent England, because he has represented Spain in the youth level, and on that time he hadn't acquired England passport. Note, Diego Costa has played for Brazil in friendlies before before he switched to Spanish National Team, but he had Spanish passport when he first represent Brazil. Same case for Thiago Motta who played for Brazil twice in friendlies before switching to Italy, as he have Italian from his ancestry.

 

[AirWolf]

I see the selectors went for basically our SA A team for the T20 series with Sri Lanka.

Behardien (Captain)
JJ Smuts
Miller
De Bruyn
Tahir
Kuhn
Mosehle
Ngidi
Parnell
Dane Patterson
Phangiso
Phehlukwayo

:wtf:

 

[Neoprod]

:wtf:

+1, that's a dodgy looking line-up. Reeza Hendricks is also in the 13 man squad - AB and Morne may join up for match 3 if they come through domestic games.

 

[sand_man]

So the count is now 8 players who have represented the Proteas in one format or another are now signed out by Kolpak:

1. Kyle Abbott
2. Rilee Rossouw
3. Marchant de Lange
4. David Wiese
5. Simon Harmer
6. Colin Ingram
7. Stiann van Zyl
8. Hardus Viljoen

Grief!

Are there any more to come?

Yip, money talks BS walks...

Our cricket will follow rugby's example.

Can't blame our top players chasing the big bucks vs the bureaucracy of maybe/maybe not representing the Proteas.

I can't judge. At best a top professional cricketer has a career of maybe 15 years. It's not comparable to the life cycle of your average employee who retires at 65.

 

[WaxLyrical]

I see the selectors went for basically our SA A team for the T20 series with Sri Lanka.

Behardien (Captain)
JJ Smuts
Miller
De Bruyn
Tahir
Kuhn
Mosehle
Ngidi
Parnell
Dane Patterson
Phangiso
Phehlukwayo

Good to see JJ finally in there. Looked very good at U/19 level.
Not familiar with Ngidi. Rest more or less make the grade, although it appears Chris Morris days are numbered.

Might be the next to go kolpak.

 

[stefan9]

Good to see JJ finally in there. Looked very good at U/19 level.
Not familiar with Ngidi. Rest more or less make the grade, although it appears Chris Morris days are numbered.

Might be the next to go kolpak.

Ngidi is a young quick from the titans, KP is very impressed by him when he faced him in the 20/20 comp here.

Morris wasn't considered due to the fact that he just came from a knee injury and his return game was washed out ( no ball bowled between titans and knights last weekend.)

Also Morris won't go kolpak and same applies to Miller. They get huge amounts in IPL and the IPL season clashes with the county season. To put it in terms Dave Miller's IPL deal is worth 30 times what abbott's county deal is and he stays eligible for international. Morris's deal is worth 13 times what abbott will earn in county cricket.

There is no reason for guys with big ipl deals to go kolpak.

 

[stefan9]

The more I look at this Kolpak thing, the more unenforceable some of these rules look.

Thinking about soccer players playing in Europe under the same Kolpak ruling - none of them give up national representation to play in England (for example). How does the ECB get away with something the FA can't?

The FA have the same concerns about overseas players hindering the number of homegrown players in the top league so I would have thought if it was legal, they would have implemented a similar rule to make foreign players think twice about signing up with a Premier League club.

Difference between football and cricket is there is no stopping of international careers due to the fact that football has specific international windows. Sadly that is impossible with cricket due to cricket being influenced by weather so you can't have one window for everyone.

Giving up your international career isn't a prerequisite of the Kolpak ruling it is something that counties write into the deal cause they don't want to lose players for international duty.

Not quite true, Diego Costa being a prime example

Diego Costa never played a competitive game for Brazil. He played a friendly so nothing I said is incorrect. So can change nationalities if you have only played a friendly but once you play a competitive game you can't change to another national team.

 

[DanDango]

HE van der Dussen, PE Kruger, ACR Birch, SSB Magala, C Jonker and BC Fortuin is unlucky not to get in the T20 squad. Kruger is 100 time better then Reeza Hendricks, Fortuin > Phangiso.

 

[stefan9]

Yes a few lucky guys. Can count Dane Paterson among them as well, mangala/birch should have gotten the nod ahead of him.

 

[Speedster]

Diego Costa never played a competitive game for Brazil. He played a friendly so nothing I said is incorrect. So can change nationalities if you have only played a friendly but once you play a competitive game you can't change to another national team.

Well, in that case only cricketers who have played in World Cups or Champions Trophies should be considered to have played competitive games for SA. The others are free to change nationalities.

 

[bwana]

Good to see JJ finally in there. Looked very good at U/19 level.
Not familiar with Ngidi. Rest more or less make the grade, although it appears Chris Morris days are numbered.

Might be the next to go kolpak.

Agreed - nice guy, happy to see him included finally.

 

[Baxteen]

after a week of it being Obvious.

Crictinfo is calling it as it is here

With international opportunities for white South Africans increasingly limited because of transformation quotas, the rush has been marked. David Wiese joined Sussex on Monday Kyle Abbott and Rilee Rossouw signed up with Hampshire last week.

its just the first time they are straight up saying its because of the Quota system.