To all potential Felons

On the dude with an idea theory - then he needs to get the copyright first ain't it! If it's financially a problem them he needs a VC and contracts to protect himself.

Deb's and Gav, there is a middle ground. the guy that invented the wheel deserves his 14 years of patent, that doesn't mean he can't share or license the idea, but after 14 years it goes public domain, that's the way it works.

There's another very good comparison of the proprietary capatalist and the philanthropic socialist:

The USA vs the USSR - After 50 years of exactly what the two of you are proposing, which country won the cold war? Which economy actually worked and survived?
 
Debbie2 said:
Gavin, please, grasp the concept of the difference between theory and practical example, because the heart of the wider debate is about mankind's reliance on theories of information ownership that are no longer appropriate, no longer workable, or, at the very least, entirely inadequate in the context of a networked society.
Click to expand...

:confused: I fail to see how my example is not workable in theory and practice?

Debbie2 said:
Flawed blanket theory. Appropriate to apply in some cases, inappropriate in other cases. To illustrate- What if you had invented the wheel?
Click to expand...

No difference, I am pretty sure Firestone keep their specific makeup of the wheel secret. Like I have mentioned on many occasions I am not complaining about people making their own version of anything and giving it away. I am complaining about people stealing someones elses and passing it on or using it themselves without any changes at all.

Another example.
I d/l a movie, I then shred the movie to death and add in my own pieces everywhere. This is classed as art by some obscure parts of our society and is acceptable. Same thing as the wheel, you see mine and you make your own. That is then yours. You don't need to pay me for it.

Debbie2 said:
What you are telling me here, Gavin, is the extent to which you would go in order to cling to the 'rightness' of the theory you uphold.... you are saying you would still insist that the theory is 'right' even when that theory prescribes behaviour that, in my opinion, is abhorrent. **Allow room for the alteration of the theory**.
Click to expand...

In my opinion what is morally right is not always legally right. You of all people fully understand that. You fell a great need to help society at large and that is fantastic. However I don't generally. Morally you may have the high ground but legally we are equal.

lets stop this discussion now because it won't end as we are on very distinct sides of the spectrum. You believe in sharing all information and uplifting society as a whole. I believe the only way society will ever be uplifted as a whole is by allowing people to look after themselves first and foremost. It's the classical Communism - Socialism - Capitalism debate.

I am a staunch capitalist and don't believe in free handouts. Survival of the fittest and all that.

Oh and you have twisted this thread away from stealing movies off the internet to the greater good of humanity. Nice :D

[Edit] I see doobiwan got the same idea across with less waffling. kudos....
I fully agree with limited patents and copyrights. Software should be 10 years and then the source should be released.
 
Last edited:
AntiThesis said:
Yes. Yes you can. Someone like that would be deliberately holding back the progress of the entire human race because he/she feels that money is more important. BS.
Click to expand...

err... thats the whole purpose of a CAPITALIST society, profit first and the rest last.
 
stix said:
Piracy is just another form of distribution, if companies are going to persist in not embracing new distribution channels and trying to shut them down - they just going to lose - if they looked at how the market wants its bytes - ie what the customer wants to pay and how they want to receive their purchase - they would shut up embrace the tech and carry on growing their bottom line.

But alas they interested in protecting exorbitant prices for short term gain - i have little or no sympathy for these companies

T
Click to expand...

Yes from the haves to the have nots :D
 
Well I guarantee right this second that if I do come up with something that can be genuinely beneficial to the human race, it'll be up on every website I can find simultaneously.

I don't believe that a capatalist regime can work. It's simply in a state of precarious balance.
 
Let me give you all a quick example of what I would deem to be the perfect scenario for video and audio content ...

For video, specifically tv shows distributors should be putting episodes up onto their websites with adverts - make the process of downloading easy enough (rss feeds ...) and people will switch to downloading straight from them - they still make money.

Movies are slightly more difficult - but making going out to actually see a movie more attractive would help as well as leaving the commercials at the beginning etc.

Audio - simple enough: radio shows leave in ads (podcasts anyone?) and music, as I have already described, should be made available for free to promote the artist ... money should be made from live performances ...

Natas said:
In south Africa there is an organisation called SAFACT, ie the South African Federation Against Copyright Theft....they are an industry body that represents all the major studios here in South Africa....these guys confiscate fake dvd's like its going out of fassion. People bring in 40 foot containers full of dvd's through the durban harbour....the durban harbour only manages to inspect about 5% of the containers coming throught the harbour...I have seen all the confiscated DVD's at the counterfeit goods depot....and there are litelrally tons of these things....but they come on faster than SAFACT can possible take them off the market.....
Click to expand...
That is blatant stealing (selling counterfeit dvds) - and completely dishonest ...

AntiThesis said:
I don't believe that a capatalist regime can work. It's simply in a state of precarious balance.
Click to expand...
I think that it will work - but not in it's current form, people have a need for self gain ... i'm not sure what we will see ... but it will be different, and yet the same ... i think :rolleyes:
 
kilps said:
Movies are slightly more difficult - but making going out to actually see a movie more attractive would help as well as leaving the commercials at the beginning etc.
Click to expand...

Quick useless trivia, the movie (Ster Kinekor, Nu Metro) distributors make a loss from showing movies at cinemas. They actually make their money from food and beverages in the cinemas.

So next time I complain about the idiotic pricing of cinema tickets remind me of what I just said :D...

I stopped going to the cinema a long time ago because I didn't feel like I was getting value for money, I rather now just wait until it hits the video store if I think it looks good or DSTV if it looks okay....
 
Everything stays the same. :(

I look forward to the day when capitalism fails. I don't know what should take its place but a system which is so very... unfair (bad word) shouldn't stay.

I'm getting vaguely sidetracked here but don't you think a nice global threat would be handy? Something that will threaten the entire planet and force countries to forget about their stupid borders and stupid money grabbing.
 
AntiThesis said:
In other news, a young man from South Africa invented a way to produce cheap, clean and efficient energy. Unfortunately nobody will ever see this idea come to light as a large oil corporation took out copyright on the invention.

What an excellent world to live in.
Click to expand...

If someone invented a method to produce clean energy it would be a patentable invention and could not be protected by way of copyright. As per my previous post, there is a global view that information must be free. however the inventor of an invention must be given a way to recoup his expenses and be rewarded for efforts. A patent therefore only exists for ten years. Also for a patent to exist, it must be applied for. A patent application MUST contain ALL the information relating to the invention and will infact not be valid unless it cleary and accurately explains how the invention works.

Patents are then published to reveal this information to the world. this information then forms part of "the state of teh art' and people can then improve thereon, or make furhter advances based on the information in the patent. However, only the owner of the patent can exploit the invention on a commercial basis during the limited time of teh Patent registrations existence. Once the invention is no longer subject to a valid patent it can be exploited by all and sundry.

In this way it can be seen that even the law of intellectual property contains limitations on how people can enforce the monopolies given to them by IP law. but my views on the limitaions and whether they are sufficient is beyond teh scope of this post.
 
I betcha such an invention (if not already done) will be squashed flat by the winners of Capitalism, giant oil companies :)
 
You like the conspiracy theories don't you Anti :D....

As posted, if someone did invent it and did apply for a patent everyone could get the info by now. Pipe dreams in my opinion...
 
AT, rampant capitalism has to be held in check, that's why there are things like Antitrust Laws.

Don't look at America as the only way to do capitalism. It's also not the only way. Look at countries like the UK and Aus which are technically Socialist - They provide a net for those who need it, but don't limit those who want to achieve for themselves.

And who's fault is it that the oil companies are so powerful? Ours for not buying Bio-diesel, or opting for bicycles.
 
Gavin,

You are right that we can discuss this until the cows come home. Interestingly, I have agreed with you more than anything else.

Morally, I know I don't have the highground. Why? Because, when it actually comes down to it, I currently take more from society than what I give. I have been protected by these awfully comfortable university "walls". It is largely thanks to taxpayers- not me- that I have been able to study further. I am not making noticable contributions to our economy, nor am I supporting a family or bringing up children. Respect to that. Gavin... I know I don't have the moral highground.

As for your comments on what I believe, I would like to point out that you have made a lot of incorrect assumptions about my beliefs on economics.

Time for a Winston Churchill moment-

If you're not a liberal at 20 then you have no heart.
If you're not a conservative by 40 then you have no brain.
Click to expand...

Thank you Winston ;) edit /person who decided to attribute this to Winston

Oh and you have twisted this thread away from stealing movies off the internet to the greater good of humanity. Nice :D
Click to expand...

Yes, it was my evil plan all along.

:D
 
Last edited:
MyDraadloos said:
Time to watch my pirate copy of Borat ......... Big up and thanks to the Pakistani crew for having the goods before Ster Kinekor !
Click to expand...
Telecine? If you're going to pirate at least wait for some decent quality :p
 
man... to pirate Borat is really low class... i wouldnt touch that movie even if you could squeeze it into a 3.5" stiffy! :p
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top
Sign up to the MyBroadband newsletter
X