US politics general thread

[Aquila ka Hecate]

Being "embarrassed" isn't good enough. The fact that people aren't angry about this is horrifying.

Yeah but it's better than the 58% of Republicans who are actually supporting the further in this.

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

they turn away legal asylum claims, too

Legal or legitimate is to be determined by a court or an immigration officer at the border, not the applicant ...

asylum seekers aren't criminals, you sociopathic troll

A fair number of the articles linked here speak of illegal immigrants, not asylum seekers, they are most definitely criminals until they actually apply for asylum, which btw you can do at a port of entry, there is no need to enter the US illegally first if asylum is your goal ...

 

[C4Cat]

Lol this is my home.

Anyway the asylum seekers are actually economic migrants, immigrating for better work opportunities than what their shîthole countries can offer. They have time to do it the right way they aren’t escaping anything except the shîthole they created themselves by voting for socialist governments.

We also have some stats. The homicide rate is lower in Mexico than in South Africa so Mexico and most South American countries are safer. So maybe educate yourself before you comment on stuff you know nothing about.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

The most commonly granted asylum petitions from Mexico are based on fear of persecution and violence from drug cartels and drug traffickers based on social group or political opinion. Applicants will claim that the government of Mexico is unwilling or unable to protect them. This situation has led to a surge in the number of Mexican asylum applications in the past few years.
Journalist, activist, and politician asylees describe instances of death threats, unlawful detention, and the assault or murder of family members in their applications. The nongovernmental organization Human Rights Watch documents "serious human rights violations—including extrajudicial killings, enforced disappearances, and torture—in the course of efforts to combat organized crime. The government has made little progress in prosecuting those responsible for recent abuses..."

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/can-i-apply-asylum-from-mexico.html

 

[Aquila ka Hecate]

Legal or legitimate is to be determined by a court or an immigration officer at the border, not the applicant ...


A fair number of the articles linked here speak of illegal immigrants, not asylum seekers, they are most definitely criminals until they actually apply for asylum, which btw you can do at a port of entry, there is no need to enter the US illegally first if asylum is your goal ...

You do know their processing system is broken?
Some families fleeing for their lives have had to wait in the wilderness - literally - while waiting for said system to get around to them.

If you're fleeing for your lives, I doubt you have money/shelter/food to tide you over the wait.

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

You do know their processing system is broken?
Some families fleeing for their lives have had to wait in the wilderness - literally - while waiting for said system to get around to them.

If you're fleeing for your lives, I doubt you have money/shelter/food to tide you over the wait.

Then criticize the broken system, don't excuse the criminals from their crimes.

 

[cerebus]

Legal or legitimate is to be determined by a court or an immigration officer at the border, not the applicant ...


A fair number of the articles linked here speak of illegal immigrants, not asylum seekers, they are most definitely criminals until they actually apply for asylum, which btw you can do at a port of entry, there is no need to enter the US illegally first if asylum is your goal ...

Firstly, what of those who aren't illegal immigrants?
Secondly, illegal immigration is a misdemeanor class offense, normally punishable by "no more than six months of incarceration and up to $250 in civil penalties for each illegal entry." It's roughly in the same class as jaywalking or late tax filing. How do you go from that to horrific detention centers where parents and children are being ripped apart? There is an enormous disparity here between the severity of the offense, and the method of deterrence.

 

[Cray]

Then criticize the broken system, don't excuse the criminals from their crimes.

Not all laws are moral and not all crimes are inexcusable...

Or do you believe it's better to risk death than to break a minor law?

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

Firstly, what of those who aren't illegal immigrants?

Different story entirely, treat them as any law abiding citizen should be treated.

There is an enormous disparity here between the severity of the offense, and the method of deterrence.

It happens and it's not fair, just ask Vicki Momberg, they're still criminals though i.e. a criminal that is only guilty of a misdemeanor is still a criminal.

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

Not all laws are moral and not all crimes are inexcusable...
Or do you believe it's better to risk death than to break a minor law?

How is applying for asylum at a port of entry instead of jumping the fence "risking death"?

 

[cerebus]

Different story entirely, treat them as any law abiding citizen should be treated.

Then why are you whitewashing this treatment by branding them all as criminals?

It happens and it's not fair, just ask Vicki Momberg, they're still criminals though i.e. a criminal that is only guilty of a misdemeanor is still a criminal.

Nobody disputes that they've broken the law. It doesn't justify the response, not even remotely. The only way anybody could think that it does is if they've been conditioned by anti-immigrant rhetoric to think of aliens as dangerous, violent subhumans

 

[Cray]

How is applying for asylum at a port of entry instead of jumping the fence "risking death"?

The US/Mexico border is 3145 KM long, do you think people fleeing for their livers without adequate food and water always have the foresight to travel to the nearest port of entry, does the minor crime of crossing the border illegally make their claim of asylum any less valid? The idea that who breaks minor laws should be treated like an average criminal is ridiculous, or have you never broken a traffic law?

 

[Unhappy438]

The US/Mexico border is 3145 KM long, do you think people fleeing for their livers without adequate food and water always have the foresight to travel to the nearest port of entry, does the minor crime of crossing the border illegally make their claim of asylum any less valid? The idea that who breaks minor laws should be treated like an average criminal is ridiculous, or have you never broken a traffic law?

That seems a bit dramatic though don't you think. Are people really fleeing for their lives from Mexico by the 1000s?

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

The US/Mexico border is 3145 KM long

There are also 48 official border crossings along that border, they'd be about 65km apart if spread evenly ...

have you never broken a traffic law?

I can neither confirm nor deny ...

 

[Cray]

That seems a bit dramatic though don't you think. Are people really fleeing for their lives from Mexico by the 1000s?

Possibly not from Mexico, my guess would be that most or migrants from Mexico of the economic variety - however I have no doubt that some of the people that eventually get to the US border are afraid at being turned away because they came from beyond mexico's southern border...

https://www.amnesty.org/en/get-involved/take-action/mexico-stop-returning-refugees/

Every year Mexico illegally forces thousands of people to return back to life-threatening situations in Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador. This practice is called refoulement, is illegal under international law, and must end now

I imagine being in Mexico illegally in the first place is what causes people to go for the illegal crossings...

 

[cerebus]

https://slate.com/news-and-politics...end-family-separation-policy-on-fox-news.html

“More kids are being separated from their parents and temporarily housed in what are essentially summer camps, or as The San Diego Union Tribune described them today, as basically looking like boarding schools,” Ingraham said on her show. “The American people are footing a really big bill for what is tantamount to a slow-rolling invasion of the United States.”

Summer camps and boarding schools :crylaugh:

 

[crackersa]

Over the last 2 or so days they've maintained all of the following:

- It isn't happening
- There is no policy
- There is a policy that we decided is good
- We decided to do it long ago and it was an easy decision
- It's good because it deters people
- The Bible says we have to
- It's Democrats' fault

Listen to Children Who’ve Just Been Separated From Their Parents at the Border

Couldn’t listen to the whole thing. Just broke my heart.

 

[crackersa]

If I have to leave SA I would do it the right way. Apply for the appropriate visa's to work in another country and generally follow their laws as a guest of that country. I wont go as an asylum seeker or refugee.

White people here need about as much asylum as brown Mexican people.

Good! At least you recognize people from the other Latin countries need asylum.

 

[crackersa]

Being "embarrassed" isn't good enough. The fact that people aren't angry about this is horrifying.

Oh there is. Trust me. The news is blowing up locally.

 

[crackersa]

Slightly off topic.....

https://www.ksat.com/news/national/texas-man-feels-sympathy-for-immigrants-buys-pizza

 

[Garson007]

Needed that wall years ago. It's only going to get worse.