VANS can self provide

I really don't think Ivy's too fussed. She's being booted, remember? Why should she care? Her objective of holding back competition has been completed while she was in office. I figured something like this would happen just before she left.

That said, I seriously hope the quality of VANS increases. This idea of provisioning wireless but using ADSL as backhaul is crap.
 
Garyvdh said:
OK, so injecting a little bit of reality into our euphoria here. We can almost certainly expect a Constitutional Court Appeal,
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Of course this would be expected, but a win first time around (and I'm seeing more and more of these recently, which to me indicates less tight restrictions, and eyes opening) could surely turn the tide more in the favour of the right people (aka, non-Telkom).
Garyvdh said:
and ICASA and the DOC are going to turn this into an issue of governmental control (for the protection of the masses) versus unrestricted competition (to the benefit of the masses).
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Protection of the few* (who have financial interest in $money_cow).

Garyvdh said:
They are going to tell the ConCourt that it will be like the unregulated Wild West and the poor public will be taken advantage of, and standards will erode, etc. etc. Will Altech have the backbone and financial clout to take it all the way?
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I would hope that someone produce some nice costing predictions of a market where Telkom isn't dominant, as I'd presume that predictions like these which could be guessed rationally (by extrapolating from history, and also taking into account how similar things have influenced other countries) would have quite a strong go at showing in court how said argument ("poor public get taken advantage of" and whatnot) is false. Standards....well..yes, we might end up with a few monkey-boy operators who don't have a clue what they are doing, but that wouldn't necessarily be vastly different from the current situation of what many WISPs are doing, I think.
 
A small step forward

Keeping reality in mind, this is probably a small step forward.

Assuming that the ruling stands, and is not overturned, VANs would need to start getting the necessary rights of way to lay cables, or obtain spectrum in order to build wireless networks. There are still many ways for the incumbents to frustrate them in this. Obtaining access to unbundled local loops will also be a long and tedious process.
This is probably best characterised as an important but small step on the long path to creating a competitive telecoms market in SA.
What this ruling does also help to do is to make a lie of the minister's comments that competition has not aided the market, since this goes to prove that the minister has actively attempted to prevent competition in the telecoms market.
 
I must say this is great news,Companies with use capital can take full advantage of this.Lets hope that in 12 months time we will see an improvement.
 
Some thoughts

Firstly, I'm ecstatic about the ruling, its an awesome step forward for the country. On the question of appeals though, I think it all depends, if the judgement is allowed to stand while the appeals continue, until such time as a successful appeal is heard, we may find that this changes the whole industry before the appeal even gets around to being concluded, by which stage, the deregulation may have gone to far to back track it.

With regards to the question of way leaves etc, if they grant the holders of VANS licenses with IECNS licenses (as seems to be what they have to do if you read the media and look at the license conversion process), then the question of way leaves to lay fiber is actually a mute one. With an ECNS license you do not have to *apply* for way leaves, you simply *INFORM* that you will be digging (on any public land), it makes those rights fairly clear.

*shrug* long road ahead, but the chaos begins, and for the good of the industry I for one and quite prepared to put up with more holes in the road for fiber cables ;p
 
SlowJoe said:
Firstly, I'm ecstatic about the ruling, its an awesome step forward for the country. On the question of appeals though, I think it all depends, if the judgement is allowed to stand while the appeals continue, until such time as a successful appeal is heard, we may find that this changes the whole industry before the appeal even gets around to being concluded, by which stage, the deregulation may have gone to far to back track it.

With regards to the question of way leaves etc, if they grant the holders of VANS licenses with IECNS licenses (as seems to be what they have to do if you read the media and look at the license conversion process), then the question of way leaves to lay fiber is actually a mute one. With an ECNS license you do not have to *apply* for way leaves, you simply *INFORM* that you will be digging (on any public land), it makes those rights fairly clear.

*shrug* long road ahead, but the chaos begins, and for the good of the industry I for one and quite prepared to put up with more holes in the road for fiber cables ;p
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this allows a community to negotiate about laying wires under their roads, they could for example finance the cabling and then use the VANS license to "legit" it or they could simply build their own network and partner with a VANS should MTN and Vodacom complain about it to icasa.
 
ok, while you're all celebrating...
Did somebody remember to wake up her Poison Ivyness so that she could hear the good news?
 
SlowJoe said:
On the question of appeals though, I think it all depends, if the judgement is allowed to stand while the appeals continue, until such time as a successful appeal is heard, we may find that this changes the whole industry before the appeal even gets around to being concluded, by which stage, the deregulation may have gone to far to back track it.
Click to expand...
Isn't the ECA supposed to work along the lines of "These are the rules now and if you don't like them argue about them later", but there is no holding up until the matter is (eventually) sorted out.
 
Suddenly that old unused VANS license is worth a lot of money.

*applause* to Altech.
*finger* at Ivy.
*finger* at IS.

Viva competition!

I am quite sure that this judgment will inspire those that have been waylaid by her royal Posonivyness to step forward, and take their rightful place in the war to drop the cost of an electron carrying data a couple of kilometers.

:p :p :p :p :p :p
 
Good on Altech! The "chosen few" was BS! Anyone with the bucks and license should be allowed to do it, or attempt at least.

Big Question: How many Vans actually have the bucks to layout a national network that can compete with telscum, Neotel etc? me thinks it won't be very many - esp if it's going to be "highest bidder for spectrum wins".

.
 
Ivork said:
Good on Altech! The "chosen few" was BS! Anyone with the bucks and license should be allowed to do it, or attempt at least.

Big Question: How many Vans actually have the bucks to layout a national network that can compete with telscum, Neotel etc? me thinks it won't be very many - esp if it's going to be "highest bidder for spectrum wins".
Click to expand...

You must question your premises. Why are you assuming that a VANS license holder must carry the full cost of a fiber run in the N-S direction down a 10km stretch of houses ? The Vans could make all the homes sign a debit order, go to the bank and convince them that based on a contractual agreement they should lend the VAns/community the funds to run the fiber and install 5.8ghz Meshnetworking hotspots every 200m on the fiber. This is how MTN builds cellphone networks. It makes no financial or engineering sense to run FTTH because no server in the world is going to allow anybody a 1gig internet connection.

There is no such thing as spectrum scarcity it is a lie perpetuated by Vodacom , MTN and Altech. To conserve spectrum given limited frequency allocations install any number of hotspots down a fiber run. As the user moves from hotspot to hotspot the meshbox hands over a DHCP lease.
 
Sheesh, the conspiracy theories are incredible there wify... the spectrum lies perpetrated by VC, MTN etc...

And you try convince 300 homes to sing a debit order for a service you don't actually have yet... go on, I dare you.
 
ToxicBunny said:
Sheesh, the conspiracy theories are incredible there wify... the spectrum lies perpetrated by VC, MTN etc...

And you try convince 300 homes to sing a debit order for a service you don't actually have yet... go on, I dare you.
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I dare you to phone http://www.nicciferguson.com/ and ask dominic to put you in contact with a VANS who will partner with your community and negotiate about the terms and conditions. I say negotiate, MTN, vodacom don't want you to be able to negotiate about anything, they simply decree their edicts and tell you what to pay - why don't you question this ?
 
captainwifi said:
I dare you to phone http://www.nicciferguson.com/ and ask dominic to put you in contact with a VANS who will partner with your community and negotiate about the terms and conditions. I say negotiate, MTN, vodacom don't want you to be able to negotiate about anything, they simply decree their edicts and tell you what to pay - why don't you question this ?
Click to expand...

I double dare you :rolleyes:
 
Why do the trolls think daring back is a way to sidestep an inital dare?... it just boggles the mind.

Anywho, of course VC and MTN don't negotiate with a small community since economies of scale are not there for them... but that is a concept that I spose escapes wify, since it doesn't fit his conspiracy theory in the slightest.
 
I just hope this doesn't take to long to effect the consumer aka. me
 
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