Buthelezi slams affirmative action

xtermin8or said:
... the fact that the ANC has been continuosly voted into power is testament to the fact that the people are happy with their rule ( remember we have had free and fair elections since 1994 )
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No, it just means people don't wanna vote for the opposition parties. Personally, I'll vote for whomever I think is gonna f**kup the country least... I don't care if u r black, white, brown or blue. And I would be happy to be taxed more if I am earning more and we can begin to fix the problems we have in this country!

xtermin8or said:
I personally believe we need a more effective, united and stronger opposition in parly but that is fodder for another debate
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Can't argue with you there.

Bageloo said:
I thought sub-saharan africa had recorded the fastest economic growth compared to other regions. The canines must be doing a pretty good job then.;)
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Do u mean compared to other regions in Africa?
 
But then I suppose the argument could be made of our fastest growing economy. Point? Business will carry on regardless the shackles of government (there will just be less of it.) And yes, there is less investment than there could have been. Our cherry: the tourism industry. And what be happening with that while we live in the nirvana of crime and perfect government?

Schooling, infrastructure, would have provided millions of jobs, but no, no infrastructure because no BEE, let's crow the [-]gold[/-] golf course! Gee, I wonder who got rich on that?
 
there was a stage when war was a possibility, but I think in the end both sides agreed to meet half way and work out a solution....

Then nobody took anything, and nobody gave anybody anything.....

Obviously the truth is considerably more complex, but yeah
 
At least mButhelezi talks more sense tham mBeki, if you can call his mumblings that, Iconna!
 
kilo39 said:
This issue of AA and BEE: a real bitch defending racist policies, neh? I don't doubt the policy is fiendishly clever but fact remains; how many houses have been built? How many hospitals? How many schools? How many roads, how many miles of pipe?
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your area already had these fascilities thanks to apartheid. There's been a number of hospitals, schools that have been built in the previously disadvantaged areas. There's been miles of dirt roads that have been tared, homes elctrified, homes given running water. all those things you always had.
Maybe you can also point out the connection between all of this and AA because I don't see it.

kilo39 said:
And of course: how many kids have been raped, how many street children, how many?
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Plenty. Again how is this related to AA?

kilo39 said:
Plain fact: market forces would obviate the need for AA. Mbeki supposedly introduced AA and BEE because white companies weren't opening doors, leaving the apartheid capitalistic system in place. This after 3 years in our new democracy. Did he really give anything else the chance to work? (And it seemed to be working perfectly fine before this time.)
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You are obviously speaking for yourself.

kilo39 said:
I have been working with coloured superiors and colleagues ever since (the beginning of time, including military service,) I come from CT notably not a large embedded indigenous black population. I lived for years in Gauteng.
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You'd have realised that CT needs AA even more than Gauteng. For example I have a German friend (white) down in CT who has had business taken away from him just because he used a black model in one of his portfolios. He also thought apartheid racism had gone. He had the rudest of awakenings. This is a white man I'm talking about. Do you think such people can do business with a black man? Last time I was there also I was not very impressed with the suspicious looks I got at Clifton beach. For the first time in a long time I felt like those people were thinking to themselves 'there goes a rapist and a thief'. That place has seriously fallen behind the rest of SA interms of race relations. CT can learn a few lessions from PTA.

kilo39 said:
Opening the market generally should have increased the need for (what are now AA staff,) would this be any different? But no, now we have AA and BEE which no matter your protestations are racial at base. All racists have some excuse.
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Open markets don't work well in racist environments. That is why we use quotas, to counter the racism that already exists.

kilo39 said:
BEE? Seems to only have made a difference in the boardroom at the overall expense of jobs, investment, and the future of the country.
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Again you are misunderstanding the two concepts. BEE is a boardroom issue by virtue of it being an ownership and shareholding issue. On the other hand AA is an empolymnet and education issue.

kilo39 said:
There is no doubt we have come a ways; we would have come this way anyway. How much paperwork, how much time, how many speeches, how much bullsh#t promulgating, justifying, forcing basically racist policies on the country? And here we are, talking race again! :mad: Who's fault is that?
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Apartheid != Racism. You are making an assuption that racism ended with apartheid. Apartheid was legislated racism. What about racism in the social and working circles? A racist is someone who thinks racial inequality is justified. At the moment there is racial inequality in the workplace. You are either a denialist or a blatant racist if you are opposed to measures that are meant to address this racial inequality.
 
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Bageloo : Nobody here is opposed to addressing the racial inequality in this country, but we are opposed to the way its being done because its not working the way it should and its being abused left right and centre. I do agree with Kilo to some degree that even without AA and BEE, things would have normalised in this country eventually, and it would be a much more stable and long lasting system than what is being down by AA and BEE.

Racism will always exist because some people think they are better than others, that is not something that we can fix, and it comes from ALL sides of the fence. But you must understand that the vast majority of the population of this country are not racist, and love this country and just want the best for it, but right now that is not happening. The countries future is being damaged left right and centre by short-sighted policies and incompetent politicians who are only out to line their own pockets (again this happens from all sides of the political fence).

I, for one, see this country as being a place with amazing potential which currently is being lost and squandered in the attempt to quickly right the wrongs of the past, as opposed to trying to build a better stronger rainbow nation where EVERYONE benefits as opposed to a small few.
 
ToxicBunny said:
I do agree with Kilo to some degree that even without AA and BEE, things would have normalised in this country eventually, and it would be a much more stable and long lasting system than what is being down by AA and BEE.
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True but perhaps, there was little evidence of companies embracing transformation. What do you do, wait until it normalizes? Someone had to make a decision. We need to build upon it and perhaps debate issues around the abuse and problems in implementation of the policies rather than debating the policies themselves.
 
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