Online piracy is driven by greed

w1z4rd said:
An artist takes a minute fraction of the profits from big music labels, most musicians make their money in live concerts, and ask Colbie Caillat and Justin (*spit*) Bieber that. If it wasnt for the free audience and distribution method of YouTube we might never have heard of them and many many other artists. If your music is that good it will go big no matter what and you will still make loads of cash. Show me one musician the internet has made poor... and Ill show you a bad musician.
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Surely you of all people, wizard, should recognise that when an artist puts his stuff up on Youtube, or his music on a free download site, he is doing so freely, and thereby granting a right to the users of that service to use the work as is normal for the users of that particular service. Do not confuse distribution channels and media with property rights. They are very distinct issues. Piracy in the first place concerns property rights, and only secondarily does it concern distribution technologies.
 
Arthur said:
In this scheme:
(a) all full-time permanent employment would cease within one month.
(b) there's no way for money to actually get into the system in the first place. In the final analysis, real money is only produced by real actual work done, not by putative savings. Cost reductions do not generate revenue, but only affect profitability. Profit is not money.
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Arthur it is not scheme, it is a discussion where I extend on your idea with my idea, and I did say just before your {snip} this following example can not get applied to all jobs(I should have said situations).

Lets rather say the employee made a product the company X sells and still make money of and the employee's new product/work is not such a great success?
 
True but digital stealing in this day and age is enabled with a few clicks without cameras or witnesses.
 
Oh and because no1's watching, ppl dont have a concience...
 
Arthur said:
Ah, a social crusader out to right the wrongs in society! When I steal I'm hurting the baddies and crooks in Hollywood - they make too much! At least Robin Hood had the heart to give his proceeds to the poor. Do you?

C'mon, man. Either drop the pretence and just admit to being a thief, or get consistent and reject the free market and become a communist. Anything else is hot air and self-delusion, because this "thinking" fools no-one else.
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Don't confuse my rant for caring, I was merely pointing something out. I have 0 greed, I just frankly don't give a s*** when it comes to piracy in the first place. I am just stating why it happens. But yes PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not mistake me for anyone who gives a s*** about the people getting screwed or the people doing the screwing, I am just sick of the piracy *tears**sob**sob* bull**** coming from people who make more in a day then most people make in a lifetime. It's getting old.
 
Arthur said:
Surely you of all people, wizard, should recognise that when an artist puts his stuff up on Youtube, or his music on a free download site, he is doing so freely, and thereby granting a right to the users of that service to use the work as is normal for the users of that particular service. Do not confuse distribution channels and media with property rights. They are very distinct issues. Piracy in the first place concerns property rights, and only secondarily does it concern distribution technologies.
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I dont believe in intellectual property in its current form. Sorry. Its going to go. It fks up the world so badly that no enlightened future generation could allow it to remain as it is. I believe in limited copyright for artists and musicians, but not this abomination we have today.

Do you know Time Warner owns "happy birthday to you" song?
 
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d-_-b said:
Arthur it is not scheme, it is a discussion where I extend on your idea with my idea, and I did say just before your {snip} this following example can not get applied to all jobs(I should have said situations).

Lets rather say the employee made a product the company X sells and still make money of and the employee's new product/work is not such a great success?
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Sorry, d-_-b/ My apologies. I didn't mean it in a derogatory way. Thanks for being such decent chap.
 
w1z4rd said:
I dont believe in intellectual property in its current form. Sorry. Its going to go.
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Wow, what a convenient way to avoid a very good point!

Fact of the matter is until "it goes" piracy = theft!
 
AJB said:
Wow, what a convenient way to avoid a very good point!

Fact of the matter is until "it goes" piracy = theft!
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And "anti-piracy" = rape

If we are going to make up meanings like you do, Ill do the same.

Luckily words and terms have legal meanings, and you are not one of the people that define it. Copyright infringement does not fit the legal definition of theft so even the judicial system says you are wrong. Its copyright infringement whether you want to lie to yourself and others or not.
 
Arthur said:
Cost reductions do not generate revenue, but only affect profitability. Profit is not money.
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Oh? So, let's see. I sell something for R100 that I paid R80 for. I am left with R20. If I can sell it for R110, I'll be left with R30. If I can only sell it for R100 but can reduce the cost to R70, I'll be left with R30. Somehow the latter is less real than the former?
 
w1z4rd said:
I dont believe in intellectual property in its current form. Sorry. Its going to go. It fks up the world so badly that no enlightened future generation could allow it to remain as it is.

Do you know Time Warner owns "happy birthday to you" song?
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So? DId you know it produces $2m a year for two foundations?

And did you know the Estate of John Lennon owns "Imagine"? Great, eh.
 
Mercury said:
Oh? So, let's see. I sell something for R100 that I paid R80 for. I am left with R20. If I can sell it for R110, I'll be left with R30. If I can only sell it for R100 but can reduce the cost to R70, I'll be left with R30. Somehow the latter is less real than the former?
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Of course. But you first have to sell it for R100. And that R100 has to represent real value, which is in reality a representation of real labour, real goods. Once you go outside that loop, the representational value of money goes awry. In short, money doesn't come from trees. Nor the Mint.
 
The absolute truth for most advocating piracy because of price is that if you are offered 2 options 2 download the same 2mb song of the exact same quality, one for free and the other for $2, you'll take the free version.

EOF
 
w1z4rd said:
Intellectual property is costing lives and money. Worth it?
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Cut to the chase: It's either that or communism. I'll prefer liberty, which is not always the cheapest or easiest option. But it is the only just and moral one. Attacking property - intellectual or otherwise - is a recipe for an even greater tyranny. It is also the biggest cause of war and violence.
 
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Arthur said:
Ah, a social crusader out to right the wrongs in society! When I steal I'm hurting the baddies and crooks in Hollywood - they make too much! At least Robin Hood had the heart to give his proceeds to the poor. Do you?
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Sorry Arthur I don't really copy content the only thing you might find on me is TV Series but just PM me and we can meetup at Menlyn and quickly share some of the little content I have, I will even buy you a coffee.

Please note I'm not condescending or sarcastic above.

Arthur said:
C'mon, man. Either drop the pretence and just admit to being a thief, or get consistent and reject the free market and become a communist. Anything else is hot air and self-delusion, because this "thinking" fools no-one else.
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I will admit I which there is away for me to watch Game of Thrones legally in South Africa. But until somebody can give me viable alternative to get my hands on to the Intellectual/Digital Property I want to have access to I will need to ask my girlfriend to bring me a copied version.

Also a Thief is a person who steals another person's property. The big discussion going on is if digital property must have the same right then tangible property, and in my eyes seeing it is a new kind of property, we need new kind of rules and regulations(system) to manage this property. One also need to keep in mind how easy it is to make "illegal" copies of this digital property when one creates this new system.

This new system will be something between a free market and socialist system.
 
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AJB said:
I think d-_-b was being sarcastic?
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No, I was joking(tong in the cheek, for my own stupidity) but I was not sarcastic.

Because being sarcastic means I want to mock the person that helped me and in contrary I really find it useful if people help me without mocking me or try to look down at me!
 
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Arthur said:
SO what form do you see in the future?
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Once we develop replicators (and Im pretty sure we will get this in the next 1000 years)... greed shouldnt really be the motive that drives people. Im kinda hoping we dedicate ourselves to more noble causes than greed. I imagine that people will be motivated by improving themselves and knowledge, so it will be more free and open.
Don't get sidetracked into distribution and technology.
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Distribution is one of the biggest reasons for piracy. So is technology... they saying the same things about P2P now that they were saying about photostat machines (apparently the photostat machine was meant to the "book killer").
Real rights are described legally.
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Yup, by the people with the best paid lobby groups.
 
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