Scottish Referendum on Independence

Should Scotland be an independent country?

  • Yes

    Votes: 59 53.2%
  • No

    Votes: 52 46.8%

  • Total voters
    111
  • Poll closed .
BRITISH POUND JUMPS AFTER SCOTLAND REJECTS INDEPENDENCE

The British pound jumped in early trading on Friday after Scotland rejected independence from the United Kingdom in a landmark referendum.

Sterling climbed by almost one percentage point to 1.6525 dollars before settling at around 1.64 dollars, after polls showed Scotland had voted decisively to remain in the 307-year-old union.

"The excitement is over," said Commerzbank analyst Ulrich Leuchtmann said.

The pound also strengthened against other major currencies, hitting a two-year high of 1.2785 euros. Sterling also traded at a 6-year-high against the Japanese yen.


Source : Sapa-dpa /gm
Date : 19 Sep 2014 09:52
 
Andy Murray confirmed he will play for Great Britain in the Davis Cup match against the United States next March whatever the outcome of the Scottish independence referendum.

The world No 12 broke his silence on the subject with a tweet in the early hours of Thursday morning backing a 'yes' vote.

That left question marks over Murray's continued commitment to the British team should the union remain in place.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/tennis/andy-murray-confirms-he-will-play-for-great-britain-at-the-davis-cup-despite-backing-yes-campaign-9742643.html

Guess we English have still got that dour Scot to back for Wimbleton next year then :D
 
Or you can't believe they wheren't all taken in by Salmond' lies ?

From Kent it may look that way to you, as you wipe the sweat off your brow ;)

I believe there was more to gain for Scotland if they stood on their own.
The proof is in the pudding (or the promises made in this case)
 
In a world that is increasingly interconnected and interdependent, yet another nation-state is the exact opposite of what is needed. Good on the Scots for voting with their heads, not their hearts.
 
Final Results

Overall - No (2 001 926 vs 1 617 989) (55.3% vs 44.7%)

Areas:

Aberdeen - No (84 094 vs 59 390) (58.61% vs 41.39%)
Aberdeenshire - No (108 606 vs 71 337) (60.36% vs 39.64%)
Angus - No (45 192 vs 35 044) (56.32% vs 43.68%)
Argyll & Bute - No (37 143 vs 26 324) (58.52% vs 41.48%)
Clackmannanshire - No (19 036 vs 16 350) (53.8% vs 46.2%)
Dumfries & Galloway - No (70 039 vs 36 614) (65.67% vs 34.33%)
Dundee - Yes (39 880 vs 53 620) (42.65% vs 57.35%)
East Ayrshire - No (44 442 vs 39 762) (52.78% vs 47.22%)
East Dunbartonshire - No (48 314 vs 30 624) (61.2% vs 38.8%)
East Lothian - No (44 283 vs 27 467) (61.72% vs 38.28%)
East Renfrewshire - No (41 690 vs 24 287) (63.19% vs 36.81%)
Edinburgh - No (194 638 vs 123 927) (61.1% vs 38.9%)
Falkirk - No (58 030 vs 50 489) (53.47% vs 46.53%)
Fife - No (139 788 vs 114 148) (55.05% vs 44.95%)
Glasgow - Yes (169 347 vs 194 739) (53.49% vs 46.51%)
Highland - No (87 739 vs 78 069) (52.92% vs 47.08%)
Inverclyde - No (27 329 vs 27 243) (50.08% vs 49.92%)
Midlothian - No (33 972 vs 26 370) (56.30% vs 43.70%)
Moray - No (36 935 vs 27 232) (57.56% vs 42.44%)
North Ayrshire - No (49 016 vs 47 072) (51.01% vs 48.99%)
North Lanarkshire - Yes (110 922 vs 115 783) (48.93% vs 51.07%)
Orkney - No (10 004 vs 4 883) (67.2% vs 32.8%)
Perth & Kinross - No (62 714 vs 41 475 (60.19% vs 39.81%)
Renfrewshire - No (62 067 vs 55 466) (52.81% vs 47.19%)
Scottish Borders - No (55 553 vs 27 906) (66.56% vs 33.44%)
Shetland - No (9 951 vs 5 669) (63.71% vs 36.29%)
South Ayrshire - No (47 247 vs 34 402) (57.87% vs 42.13%)
South Lanarkshire - No (121 937 vs 100 990) (54.7% vs 45.3%)
Stirling - No (37 153 vs 25 010) (59.77% vs 40.23%)
West Dunbartonshire - Yes (28 776 vs 33 720) (46.04% vs 53.96%)
Western Isles - No (10 544 vs 9 195) (53.42% vs 46.58%)
West Lothian - No (65 682 vs 53 342) (55.18% vs 44.82%)
 
Here's a comment from Professor Philip Booth, from the UK's Institute of Economic Affairs:


Cameron's monumental error - the pursuit of the mediocre as the enemy of the perfect

In denying the Scots the option of devo-max, David Cameron made arguably the most monumental mistake of any recent premiership. The fairly narrow ‘no’ vote could lead to the worst possible of outcomes.

The economic justification for a union between two countries is that it allows for the provision of joint public goods more efficiently. This may include things such as border control (assuming that both Scots and English would like free migration between the two countries), foreign policy and defence, but probably very little else. It would also satisfy traditionalists who would like to see the two nations stay together: we may be ‘better together’ but we don’t have to have the same pensions systems.

Indeed, if we had a union with nearly all powers devolved, this would take us back to the situation that existed at the time of the Act of Union. At that time, the government did very little except manage debt and provide defence. Everything else was devolved – to the people.

So, what about everything else? Pensions, welfare to people of working age, education, health, policing, justice, and so on, make up the vast majority of public spending. The economic evidence suggests significant efficiency gains from fiscal decentralisation in these areas. However, these efficiency gains are only realised if the decentralised entity is also responsible for raising the taxes to finance the services.

As such, I would propose that, apart from a very small number of union-funded items financed by a single union-wide tax, Scotland should have complete tax raising powers and complete control of its own spending. There would be no direction from Westminster. Existing debt would be managed jointly but, in the future, the union as a whole would only incur debt in relation to the tiny number of things it financed on a union-wide basis. If Scotland could not raise the taxes to pay for spending on welfare it would have to raise debt on its own account with no possibility of any bailout. This debt would not be taken as collateral or bought in monetary policy operations by any union-wide central bank under any circumstances.

There would be other substantial benefits from this approach. The Rest of the UK and Scotland could decide on the policy mix that most closely matched the wishes of the electorate in each nation. Each nation could copy policies that worked from the other. And fiscal discipline arising from Scotland directly raising revenue to fund its welfare system would make it more likely that the system would be reformed. When it comes to issues such as regulation and monetary policy, the two nations – still in the United Kingdom – could either agree to go their separate ways or agree a common policy.

It might be argued that all this will all happen in any case now there has been a ‘no’ vote. However, if Cameron had presented devo super-max as a referendum option at the start, it could have been granted on his terms. There could have been a UK parliament to decide on a very small number of issues (such as defence) and Scottish MPs would have had no say on any other matters.

However, in the post-referendum chaos, it is likely that a scrap between the various interests will lead to a compromise position whereby Scottish MPs are allowed to vote on the additional devolved matters in the British parliament – especially if Labour wins the election in May. In other words, there will be a group of MPs who are voting on issues that have nothing to do with any of their constituents. This situation existed in the nineteenth century through the concept of ‘rotten boroughs’. They were mainly abolished in the 1832 Reform Act. The outcome of the negotiations following the result this morning risks taking us back in that direction. This is the fourth best outcome.

The best outcome would have been ‘devo super-max’, refused by Cameron. The second and third best outcomes (in no particular order) would have been independence and the status quo. The victory for the status quo is likely to lead to the worst of all possible outcomes – devo max with Scottish MPs still voting on issues that do not affect Scotland.

In many areas of government policy we at the IEA argue that the pursuit of the perfect is the enemy of the good. In this case, Cameron’s rejection of the perfect has been the friend of the worst possible outcome. Or, to put it another way, the pursuit of the mediocre has been the enemy of the perfect.
 
I think that this result once against shows the futility of measuring sentiment through social media, especially Twitter and Facebook. Those who shout the loudest aren't necessarily indicative of the true state of affairs.

I knew there was a silent majority out there, and in fact the win was slightly more comprehensive than all of the most recent polls suggested.
 
I knew there was a silent majority out there, and in fact the win was slightly more comprehensive than all of the most recent polls suggested.
Whilst neutral on the outcome of the vote I always viewed it as the romantics versus the pragmatists. It would be interesting to know the percentage turnout of the 16/17 year old vote which I presume would be romantics. I know my view on politics at that age was very different to now, very immature to be honest.
 
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FEATURE AFTER REJECTING INDEPENDENCE, SCOTS COUNT COST OF REFERENDUM
BY BEN NIMMO, DPA

Scots may have voted overwhelmingly against independence, but the consequences of the referendum are likely to reverberate for years to come.

The counting of votes is over in Scotland's referendum on independence -now the country will have to calculate the costs.

According to the Scottish government, organizing the poll cost some 13.7 million pounds (17.3 million euros), with millions more being spent by campaigners.

But the political and personal costs have been much higher, and could take far longer to assess.

"The debate has created some deep divisions in our country. It has been a campaign that has energized and divided," Alistair Darling, former British chancellor and leader of the pro-union Better Together campaign, said after the result was confirmed.

It is a comment that many on the streets have echoed.

"It's made people interested in politics again. They've suddenly got the feeling that their vote can make a difference," one Yes campaigner, who only gave his name as Gary, told dpa.

The figures would reflect that. According to official statistics, 97 per cent of the electorate registered to vote. Turnout was 84.5 per cent. That number was 63.8 per cent in the general election of 2010.

In the country of 5 million, thousands of electoral workers in more than 2,600 polling stations tallied some 3.5 million ballots after elections that ran from 7 am to 10 pm, in a grand show of democracy.

In the days before the vote, it was the major topic of conversation across the country, and across a wide spectrum of age groups.

The referendum was "a triumph for the democratic process and for participation in politics," said Alex Salmond, leader of the Yes campaign, as he conceded defeat.

But the campaign was deeply divisive. Canvassers on both sides spoke of occasional intimidation and threats, although police said that very few incidents had been reported.

People on both sides said that the issue had exposed divisions between Scots and English, rich and poor, town and country.

"It's divided families; it's divided friends," said one No campaigner. "It's polarized people and caused a lot of ill-feeling, and that's not going to go away."

It is impossible to predict how long that polarization will last, but it is unlikely to be a swift process.

"We're going to have a job of work to get things healed afterwards," Liberal Democrat politician Michael Moore acknowledged in a BBC interview after the result.

The political cost, too, is high. In the final weeks of campaigning, the British government proposed legislation granting more powers to the Scottish authorities. Early Friday, Prime Minister David Cameron announced that draft legislation to that effect would be published by January.

"It is inconceivable that we would just sit and tolerate the status quo," Moore said.

And on both sides of the divide, the leaders are clear: After this referendum, things will never be the same again, for Scotland and the United Kingdom as a whole.

Deputy First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said: "The country has been changed forever."


Source : Sapa-dpa /gm
Date : 19 Sep 2014 11:09
 
I think that this result once against shows the futility of measuring sentiment through social media, especially Twitter and Facebook. Those who shout the loudest aren't necessarily indicative of the true state of affairs.

I knew there was a silent majority out there, and in fact the win was slightly more comprehensive than all of the most recent polls suggested.

Only 4 out of 32 councils voted yes. All the countryside councils voted no. European politicians wish they could win elections with margin. By western standards this is a wide margin. By Russian, North Korean and others, it's close. You only have to look at Alex Salmonds response to see how comprehensive it was.
 
I think that this result once against shows the futility of measuring sentiment through social media, especially Twitter and Facebook. Those who shout the loudest aren't necessarily indicative of the true state of affairs.

I knew there was a silent majority out there, and in fact the win was slightly more comprehensive than all of the most recent polls suggested.

Agreed on the social media, unless it's for a Bieber concert that is. But as for ' Those who shout the loudest aren't necessarily indicative of the true state of affairs' I would argue that the conventional media shouted extremely loud, and despite that this was still a competition.

I still think that the Yes campaign can chalk this up as a win of sorts. They came from very far behind, and noone really expected them to win.A 45% vote of no confidence in Westminster cannot be ignored
 
I'm sure everyone can agree (from both sides of the debate) that Piers Morgan should fulfill his promise and fek off to the US:

Few offers could surely be more tempting to the Scottish voting public than the one Piers Morgan just made on Twitter.

While the nation collectively raised their eyebrows before bursting into laughter at the notion that a second royal baby would persuade them to stick with the Union, the former Daily Mirror editor gave them a serious bid to consider.

They might not have to suffer living on the same island as him if they vote ‘No’ to Scottish Independence.

“Dear People of Scotland,” his post read, “if you vote NO, I promise to go straight back to America. #indyref”

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...cotland-votes-no-to-independence-9732207.html
 
Agreed on the social media, unless it's for a Bieber concert that is. But as for ' Those who shout the loudest aren't necessarily indicative of the true state of affairs' I would argue that the conventional media shouted extremely loud, and despite that this was still a competition.

I still think that the Yes campaign can chalk this up as a win of sorts. They came from very far behind, and noone really expected them to win.A 45% vote of no confidence in Westminster cannot be ignored

Well the Scots are going to get more powers, so that is good. Just what those powers are remain a mystery.

I'm personally more interested (English heritage and all) in what this means for the English.
 
Well the Scots are going to get more powers, so that is good. Just what those powers are remain a mystery.

I'm personally more interested (English heritage and all) in what this means for the English.
I think to be fair, the needs to be devolution of powers for all the countries in the union. But the question is the same as for Scotland. Will the parties introduce anything that will possibly lead to an actual dilution of their own powers?
 
I think to be fair, the needs to be devolution of powers for all the countries in the union. But the question is the same as for Scotland. Will the parties introduce anything that will possibly lead to an actual dilution of their own powers?

We are starting an independence drive here in Dover. We feel that we aren't getting enough of a share of the revenues from the Euro tunnel. Of course we aren't interested in the debt, Westminster can keep that. And the Scots too :D
 
We are starting an independence drive here in Dover. We feel that we aren't getting enough of a share of the revenues from the Euro tunnel. Of course we aren't interested in the debt, Westminster can keep that. And the Scots too :D
Yeah but that won't work, cause the Folkestone people are apparently going for their independence too ;)
 
Well the Scots are going to get more powers, so that is good. Just what those powers are remain a mystery.

I'm personally more interested (English heritage and all) in what this means for the English.

The English will have to work and contribute much more to the Union, so when Barnett Formula kicks in, the English get shafted more.
 
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