SWC in SA a "BIG MISTAKE"!

[capetownguy]

There will always be a difference between a high crime rate and being at risk.

In any part of CT you are at some level of risk but this varies drastically.

If you into townships and the Cape Flats, then that puts you at risk, since these areas account for, 75% + of all crimes in Metropolitan region.

Outside of these areas e.g. walking around the V&A, new stadium...even parts of Woodstock, its on par with most cities if not lower for what one would classify at a "City Centre".

This remains a key reason for the existence of a tourism industry in Cape Town at all. Its because German, UK and many other tourists were able e.g. to walk from CT stadium to the V&A to their hotel , with a low risk or probability of experiencing crime. This, without any WC level of security and throughout the tourism peak season. Of course, there will be incidents and many, as a result of the high inequalities and weak general security in our cities.

Areas like Nyanga, Philippi are simply no go areas, unfortunately its the poor that suffer the most. Yes, "posh" areas do suffer, but one could hardly compare 17 murders in the CBD in one year compared to around 2,000 in Nyanga alone.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

BTW, the kid was stabbed because his GF was just a little too slow in handing over the handbag.

Now I'm confused - first it was someone you know was mugged and stabbed, then it was your son, and now it's your son's gf who was mugged but your son was stabbed?

 

[EtienneK]

Huh? Florida road has no walls. Nor does Melville from what I have seen.

Hence why I said they were pretty bad examples. Very dangerous areas those.

 

[LancelotSA]

Oh, and the last 10 or so crimes against me have not been reported, what for, there is no point - the police certainly have no interest !

The same applies to others, so don't go and shout your head off about lower crime stats - it's all BS, partly because crime does not get reported any more - why would anyone bother ?

Sigh! You will see that I specifically quoted the stats for murder and the paragraph shown SPECIFICALLY stated that murder rates were the most accurate means of assessing crime as it is not often that murder is not reported!

Please make sure of what I have linked to and said before making a tit of yourself.

 

[Jola]

Now I'm confused - first it was someone you know was mugged and stabbed, then it was your son, and now it's your son's gf who was mugged but your son was stabbed?

Not that difficult : I didn't want to mention the family connection, so just said someone I know (my son happens to be a member of that set).

He and the GF were both mugged (they were together), but only he was stabbed.

But why the big deal, muggings and stabbings happen in Melville every night (OK, I exaggerate, mainly weekends) - no reason to get excited !

 

[LancelotSA]

Hence why I said they were pretty bad examples. Very dangerous areas those.

Etienne, just stay in doors. Things are obviously far too dangerous for you to be venturing out of your fort. And I thank you for your valiant attempts at trying to prevent me from venturing outdoors but I'm afraid I will continue to do so. I will also endeavour to invite the foreigners I come in contact with to do the same. Who knows perhaps it will result in another friend from Scandanavia settling here and calling SA home. We do after all have three of those in our group of friends now! Not sure what they see in this apparently god forsaken country!

 

[Jola]

Sigh! You will see that I specifically quoted the stats for murder and the paragraph shown SPECIFICALLY stated that murder rates were the most accurate means of assessing crime as it is not often that murder is not reported!

And how accurate (and stable) is this relationship between murder and other crimes ? Using the murder rate as a proxy sounds like absolute BS, something that an innumerate criminologist would come up with.

I could easily imagine that murder rates would come down while other crimes double.

Oh, and you have made enough of a fool of yourself in these discussions, no need to demonstrate it further. Thanks.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

But he has a point. Those are pretty bad examples.

Nope not really. You can only walk around in areas that are surrounded by walls and security.

This:

No one said name a place where no incident of crime ever happened. They asked where you could walk around freely today. We named places we walk around freely!

I challenge you guys to name one area in London/New York/any major city, that describes what DreamKing wants (to walk around freely where there are restaurants and nightlife activities) that is 100% crime free. The point is that you don't feel safe because you don't want to feel safe. Walking around New York, you may be equally likely to be a victim of crime, but you feel safe because you think you're safer. When you guys get this constant negativity out of your minds, perhaps you'll start enjoying your life a bit more.

Also on the point of being surrounded by walls - now I'm not sure about you guys but there are vast distances involved in going from place to place (particularly in Jhb). It's not exactly like all the places that you frequent are on one street. So if you're going to be driving from place to place, you need to park your car somewhere - the obvious choice is malls/centres. This is why people are starting to provide more entertainment activities in malls.

 

[dlk001]

True, but the +40's sometimes have to go and pick up the bloodied youngsters !

BTW, the kid was stabbed because his GF was just a little too slow in handing over the handbag.

Also, I can't see what all this DOES NOT HAVE TO WITH THE WC !

Where do you think that the tourists are going to jol, a few will certainly end up in Melville, etc.

Oh, and the last 10 or so crimes against me have not been reported, what for, there is no point - the police certainly have no interest !

The same applies to others, so don't go and shout your head off about lower crime stats - it's all BS, partly because crime does not get reported any more - why would anyone bother ?

I'm sorry about your kid. Tourists are going to jol in places like Melville. Many people love it and I see no reason why tourists wont enjoy it.

 

[killadoob]

Etienne, just stay in doors. Things are obviously far too dangerous for you to be venturing out of your fort. And I thank you for your valiant attempts at trying to prevent me from venturing outdoors but I'm afraid I will continue to do so. I will also endeavour to invite the foreigners I come in contact with to do the same. Who knows perhaps it will result in another friend from Scandanavia settling here and calling SA home. We do after all have three of those in our group of friends now! Not sure what they see in this apparently god forsaken country!

Yea reading some of the posts i get what you are saying.

Damn i think this country is safe, i never feel unsafe when going about my daily business.

 

[Jola]

I challenge you guys to name one area in London/New York/any major city, that describes what DreamKing wants (to walk around freely where there are restaurants and nightlife activities) that is 100% crime free. The point is that you don't feel safe because you don't want to feel safe. Walking around New York, you may be equally likely to be a victim of crime, but you feel safe because you think you're safer. When you guys get this constant negativity out of your minds, perhaps you'll start enjoying your life a bit more.

No-one said 100%. But in many international cities a woman could walk alone at night.

In SA the cops wouldn't do that, they are not stupid - especially because they get targeted for their weapons.

 

[LancelotSA]

And how accurate (and stable) is this relationship between murder and other crimes ? Using the murder rate as a proxy sounds like absolute BS, something that an innumerate criminologist would come up with.

I could easily imagine that murder rates would come down while other crimes double.

Oh, and you have made enough of a fool of yourself in these discussions, no need to demonstrate it further. Thanks.

Yeah, of course you are right, the fact that the person you knew, who turned out to be your son, got mugged is a far truer measure of the spiralling crime in this country.

 

[EtienneK]

Yea reading some of the posts i get what you are saying.

Damn i think this country is safe, i never feel unsafe when going about my daily business.

Need a sarcasm smiley for the above post?

 

[Jola]

Yeah, of course you are right, the fact that the person you knew, who turned out to be your son, got mugged is a far truer measure of the spiralling crime in this country.

That was only a minor incident. Guys shooting up the local shopping centre with AK-47's (twice of late), bombing local ATM's, and breaking down my gate with sledgehammers is more of a concern.

Oh, did I mention that I live in Sandton ? You obviously live in cloud-cuckoo land.

 

[LancelotSA]

No-one said 100%. But in many international cities a woman could walk alone at night.

In SA the cops wouldn't do that, they are not stupid - especially because they get targeted for their weapons.

You have the audacity to state that I am making a fool of myself and yet you appear to be proving it may be you with this post. You were the one that stated Melville is unsafe based purely on your own experience. A single mugging that you are aware of and Melville is too dangerous yet London and NY are not expected to be 100% safe! You implied a 100% crime free record was required when you wrote off the examples we gave!

 

[DreamKing]

This:


I challenge you guys to name one area in London/New York/any major city, that describes what DreamKing wants (to walk around freely where there are restaurants and nightlife activities) that is 100% crime free. The point is that you don't feel safe because you don't want to feel safe. Walking around New York, you may be equally likely to be a victim of crime, but you feel safe because you think you're safer. When you guys get this constant negativity out of your minds, perhaps you'll start enjoying your life a bit more.

exactly......... in South Africa, the crime level and the places we visited don't make us feel safe. Why we feel safe pre 1994 but not post 1994? Think about that.

and also, you can also feel free to walk on the land full of landmines ................ it is safe to walk ..........

LancelotSA: where is my answer? Safe or not safe?

 

[LancelotSA]

LancelotSA: where is my answer? Safe or not safe?

Where is your question? It clearly got buried under Etienne and Jola's drivel.

Oh I see it and had read it but never made it to the end because it was a repeat of the post I had responded to!

 

[Smooth Criminal]

exactly......... in South Africa, the crime level and the places we visited don't make us feel safe. Why we feel safe pre 1994 but not post 1994? Think about that.

Because your cronies protected you along with 10% of the population. Now the government is charged with protecting 100% of the population.

 

[DreamKing]

Where is your question? It clearly got buried under Etienne and Jola's drivel.

Oh I see it and had read it but never made it to the end because it was a repeat of the post I had responded to!

for you

from your logic, South Africa basically do not have crime.....
what's wrong?

We said "South Africa had a unacceptable crime level”, in the other words South Africa is not a safe place.

But you said South Africa is not that dangerous, so it is safe, right?

Basically a safe place does not have crime. (Crimes only happen occasionally. It is not a norm.)
Basically a dangerous place does have crimes occur daily (or period of time) as a norm.

South Africa itself could not have crime, right? Crimes are people involved. So tourists came to South Africa if we assumed no people involved, they are safe. So South Africa (the land) cannot have crimes.

People said UK is safe but South Africa is dangerous. You argue with us: SA is safe.

Your point is: UK had crime, South Africa had crime. you made UK crime = SA crime, then implied South Africa is safe. A safe place does not have so many crimes we have to worry about.

So South Africa basically does not have crimes. It is because the crimes level is normal as any other countries.)

Make sense?

Or now you want to tell us, “South Africa is safe but not that safe?”

Sorry I don’t get it ….

Either safe or not safe, no grey area.
Safe => tourists are safe to stay in SA
No Safe => tourists are NOT safe to stay in SA
(conditionally safe: with bullet proof vest on )

Just tell me, safe or not safe.

 

[DreamKing]

Because your cronies protected you along with 10% of the population. Now the government is charged with protecting 100% of the population.

I asked many of poor BLACK people already ............
they also felt safe pre 1994....
but not post 1994.

Explain please