I think you misunderstood. I wasn't disagreeing with you...
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Are Openweb throttling capped accounts?
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I think you misunderstood. I wasn't disagreeing with you...
The term throttling is used in IETF drafts for a host of things and the meaning of the term is quite clear - a deliberate imposition of the maximum throughput of traffic on a particular connection.
Rhodes University used to throttle traffic such that users over quota received only a portion of available bandwidth and many FUPs have provided for throttling to a specific access speed that is lower than what the connection otherwise allows.
RFC 2475's definition of shaper doesn't actually cover the nature of throttling as applied by ISPs in SA and it is built a lot more along the premise of differentiating services as opposed to what we've got in effect where you don't use a shaper but actually reduce the access means.
Of course the fact that the very idea of throttling is to undermine the maximum possible use premise raises questions and explains why it hasn't become entrenched in RFCs. Shaping and various allocation mechanisms are far more in tune with preserving the idea of maximized benefit off a shared contended system. The idea of capped accounts also isn't from within the depths of the RFCs
Rhodes University used to throttle traffic such that users over quota received only a portion of available bandwidth and many FUPs have provided for throttling to a specific access speed that is lower than what the connection otherwise allows.
RFC 2475's definition of shaper doesn't actually cover the nature of throttling as applied by ISPs in SA and it is built a lot more along the premise of differentiating services as opposed to what we've got in effect where you don't use a shaper but actually reduce the access means.
Of course the fact that the very idea of throttling is to undermine the maximum possible use premise raises questions and explains why it hasn't become entrenched in RFCs. Shaping and various allocation mechanisms are far more in tune with preserving the idea of maximized benefit off a shared contended system. The idea of capped accounts also isn't from within the depths of the RFCs
MickeyD
RIP
I did not make the claim so why do you want me to prove it?
school/uni/bar? Up your juvenile anus, mate.
GoofySmurf
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Care to supply the RFC for throttling. All technical terms used in ICT are clearly defined by a RFC, if there is no RFC then it is made up as there are no set technical definition.
There is a reason RFC's exists ... otherwise you get instances where ISP's create a word "throttling" and all the sheep sings it as the gospel.
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Google - "throttling site:tools.ietf.org/"
you get results in several IETF drafts
Also an RFC doesn't create a "set technical definition" an RFC is a request for comment.
The reason RFCs exist is to facilitate structured dialogue. I am a massive believer in building on RFC but the suggestion that "all technical terms used ICT are clearly defined by a RFC" is misguided and wrong.
you get results in several IETF drafts
Also an RFC doesn't create a "set technical definition" an RFC is a request for comment.
The reason RFCs exist is to facilitate structured dialogue. I am a massive believer in building on RFC but the suggestion that "all technical terms used ICT are clearly defined by a RFC" is misguided and wrong.
MickeyD
RIP
Can also look at rate limiting or bandwidth management tools...
yep
I really don't understand the gist of what GoofySmurf is trying to suggest, but then his reply to your woosh remark makes me wonder more generally.
GoofySmurf
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Yes all technical terms can be backed up by a RFC usually the "other" technical tems that we used is made up but people still understand what they mean. IE "lets bounce the server" everyone knows its hard resetting a server but there is no RFC for it cause its made up. By marking and applying shaping to certain packets or protocols you speed up or slow down traffic thus giving you the end result what you guys refer to as "throttling".
Its not to facilitate structured dialogue its there to clearly define the protocol/service etc. you can have structured dialogue around it yes and if you can get everyone in the world to agree to your technically viable definition it will be changed and updated.
So you don't see throttling as a real term at all and dismiss its use?
MickeyD
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In theory throttling is a radical form of shaping...
Sure. I'm simply trying to understand the point of this conversation...
but not exclusively as shaping is "defined" in RFC 2475
Necuno
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GoofySmurf
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Shaping/Throttling is the same thing you only use the term throttling wrong if you separate it from shaping. People and ISP's these days on the forum and on the local ict space refers to both as separate things.
IE. Tannie Sannie: Why is my internet so slow during the day
Me: Its because they are shaping your traffic at the isp
Tannie Sannie: "Looks at me with big eyes"
Me: Its throttled to a slower speed during certain hours.
Tannie Sannie: Vaguely knows what you are trying to say(but still has no clue why or what)
Throttling is the word we made up here to refer to shaping but it seems everyone refers to it as two separate things.
Within the context of ISPs I use the term throttling to refer to shaping of all protocols to a set, limited speed. I refer to shaping when referencing a specific protocol.
This sentence outright dismisses the existence of the concept of throttling . Not sure if that's what you intended, but that's how it reads.
So if I understand you correctly, there is no such thing as throttling, and when people wish to refer to "all internet protocols being rate-limited below your current maximum throughput" they need to use that exact phrase or something similar and stop using the word throttling to refer to this.
Or, if using the word throttling is acceptable to you, then I really would like to understand the point of this conversation...
MickeyD
RIP
"all internet protocols being rate-limited below your current maximum throughput" = throttling
"all internet protocols being rate-limited below your current maximum throughput" = throttling
There's no RCF. What was I supposed to do?
Go speak to MWEB Guy.
When you download over a certain threshold on their uncapped accounts, they will throttle your entire account in to oblivion for the next 30 days so you can behave yourself.
Shaping is when certain protocols are limited on the network so that other ones can flourish. So they nail torrents speed during the day so the client base can still use normal web services like email, browsing and / or real time services like video streaming.
If you are throttled, you can barely do that.
If you are just being facetious and trying to say that both are limiting your account's speed, then sure, you are right. Well done. Have an internet cookie.
It's great to know that amputation and decapitation are the same thing, really. Both refer to getting an extremity chopped off.
PostmanPot
Honorary Master
Not true, you're throttled until your usage falls under that allowed per 30 day rolling window. It could take one or two days, 10, 15 - but not 30 as if you have to wait a month.
And the usage is perfectly fair in my opinion, 200GB on a 2Mbit account, 400GB on a 4Mbit account. 100GB per 1Mbps. I'm quite happy for abusers to go elsewhere, and muck up others' experience. Not mine.
I stream a lot of online video and download large game updates. My usage is over 100Gb per 1Mbps per month. I do not however, see myself as an abuser. The South African widely accepted mentality of low internet bandwidth caps and shaping/throttling is sad.