Cool Ideas Fibre ISP - Feedback

jannier · Jan 11, 2019

The odd packet loss in Bold.
I also have latency at my 2nd hop.

|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
| WinMTR statistics |
| Host - % | Sent | Recv | Best | Avrg | Wrst | Last |
|------------------------------------------------|------|------|------|------|------|------|
| router.lan - 0 | 204 | 204 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 |
| 155.93.252.1 - 0 | 204 | 204 | 2 | 3 | 29 | 2 |
| c3h-backbone.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 204 | 204 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 |
| cd-backbone.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 204 | 204 | 1 | 1 | 6 | 1 |
| u33p-cust.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 204 | 204 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 1 |
|________________________________________________|______|______|______|______|______|______|
WinMTR v0.92 GPL V2 by Appnor MSP - Fully Managed Hosting & Cloud Provider

|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
| WinMTR statistics |
| Host - % | Sent | Recv | Best | Avrg | Wrst | Last |
|------------------------------------------------|------|------|------|------|------|------|
| router.lan - 0 | 202 | 202 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 |
| 155.93.252.1 - 0 | 202 | 202 | 2 | 4 | 61 | 3 |
| c3h-backbone.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 202 | 202 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 |
| cd-backbone.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 202 | 202 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 |
| c1p-backbone.coolideas.co.za - 1 | 198 | 197 | 18 | 19 | 21 | 21 |
| uoh-cust.coolideas.co.za - 1 | 198 | 197 | 18 | 20 | 22 | 22 |
| c72-backbone.coolideas.co.za - 3 | 183 | 178 | 19 | 20 | 27 | 21 |
|________________________________________________|______|______|______|______|______|______|
WinMTR v0.92 GPL V2 by Appnor MSP - Fully Managed Hosting & Cloud Provider

|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
| WinMTR statistics |
| Host - % | Sent | Recv | Best | Avrg | Wrst | Last |
|------------------------------------------------|------|------|------|------|------|------|
| router.lan - 0 | 203 | 203 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
| 155.93.252.1 - 0 | 203 | 203 | 2 | 4 | 63 | 4 |
| c3h-backbone.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 203 | 203 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 |
| cd-backbone.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 203 | 203 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 1 |
| uoa-cust.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 203 | 203 | 140 | 140 | 141 | 141 |
| u142-cust.coolideas.co.za - 0 | 203 | 203 | 140 | 140 | 141 | 141 |
| be20.asr01.thn.as20860.net - 0 | 203 | 203 | 141 | 141 | 152 | 141 |
| po201.dc9core1.as20860.net - 1 | 199 | 198 | 144 | 151 | 355 | 144 |
| 94.zone.4.r.dc9.redstation.co.uk - 1 | 199 | 198 | 145 | 148 | 163 | 157 |
| queen.cisp.co.za - 0 | 203 | 203 | 144 | 144 | 247 | 144 |
|________________________________________________|______|______|______|______|______|______|
WinMTR v0.92 GPL V2 by Appnor MSP - Fully Managed Hosting & Cloud Provider

Tinuva · Jan 11, 2019

sand_man said:
But 3 different destination servers and 3 consistently poor results, almost identical results? Isn't packet loss dynamic? Isn't it odd that the results are so consistent? @Wasabee! @ArtyLoop @PBCool @Tinuva

Difficult to say, but I place my bet with your line's QoS is setup incorrectly. From past experience, especially on Cisco devices, if the rate limiting (that keeps your line at the speed your ordered, eg the 200/200) is not allowing enough burst, then you see packet loss, especially on udp and icmp.

It would explain why your speeds are good, because technically there is nothing wrong with your home network, CPE, FTTH line, backhaul to ISP and also nothing wrong with the ISP. Just a config on the line speed rate limit.

ArtyLoop · Jan 11, 2019

Tinuva said:
Difficult to say, but I place my bet with your line's QoS is setup incorrectly. From past experience, especially on Cisco devices, if the rate limiting (that keeps your line at the speed your ordered, eg the 200/200) is not allowing enough burst, then you see packet loss, especially on udp and icmp.

It would explain why your speeds are good, because technically there is nothing wrong with your home network, CPE, FTTH line, backhaul to ISP and also nothing wrong with the ISP. Just a config on the line speed rate limit.

Who sets the QoS? Me or the Fibre ISP?

Tinuva · Jan 11, 2019

ArtyLoop said:
Who sets the QoS? Me or the Fibre ISP?

That would be the FTTH line provider, so Vumatel/Octotel/Frogfoot ect. I doubt you would see @sand_man 's specific issue on Openserv.

ArtyLoop · Jan 11, 2019

Tinuva said:
That would be the FTTH line provider, so Vumatel/Octotel/Frogfoot ect. I doubt you would see @sand_man 's specific issue on Openserv.

Indeed... I agree.

sand_man · Jan 11, 2019

Tinuva said:
Difficult to say, but I place my bet with your line's QoS is setup incorrectly. From past experience, especially on Cisco devices, if the rate limiting (that keeps your line at the speed your ordered, eg the 200/200) is not allowing enough burst, then you see packet loss, especially on udp and icmp.

It would explain why your speeds are good, because technically there is nothing wrong with your home network, CPE, FTTH line, backhaul to ISP and also nothing wrong with the ISP. Just a config on the line speed rate limit.

I’ve always maintained its a config issue. It coincided with the ont swap. Packet loss went from 30%-50% to the consistent 95% we see now... @PBCool

Edit: although on every other metric performance seemed to improve markedly.

Tinuva · Jan 11, 2019

sand_man said:
I’ve always maintained its a config issue. It coincided with the ont swap. Packet loss went from 30%-50% to the consistent 95% we see now... @PBCool

Edit: although on every other metric performance seemed to improve markedly.

When you do your iperf3 test, try again, as if it is a 100Mbps line. If you then get 0% to 3% loss, its probably because the burst is just enough for a 100Mbps line.

sand_man · Jan 11, 2019

I have in the past. Results were almost as bad.

Tinuva said:
When you do your iperf3 test, try again, as if it is a 100Mbps line. If you then get 0% to 3% loss, its probably because the burst is just enough for a 100Mbps line.

Tinuva · Jan 11, 2019

sand_man said:
I have in the past. Results were almost as bad.

ok lower it further until you find a speed at which it looks better

sand_man · Jan 11, 2019

Tinuva said:
ok lower it further until you find a speed at which it looks better

C:\WINDOWS\system32>iperf3.exe -R -u -b 80M -p 17001 -c queen.cisp.co.za
Connecting to host queen.cisp.co.za, port 17001
Reverse mode, remote host queen.cisp.co.za is sending
[ 4] local 192.168.1.186 port 55118 connected to 62.233.65.195 port 17001
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-1.01 sec 2.18 MBytes 18.1 Mbits/sec 0.897 ms 995/1274 (78%)
[ 4] 1.01-2.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.851 ms 1120/1220 (92%)
[ 4] 2.01-3.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.912 ms 1121/1221 (92%)
[ 4] 3.01-4.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.809 ms 1121/1221 (92%)
[ 4] 4.01-5.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.922 ms 1120/1220 (92%)
[ 4] 5.01-6.01 sec 792 KBytes 6.49 Mbits/sec 0.774 ms 1110/1209 (92%)
[ 4] 6.01-7.01 sec 808 KBytes 6.62 Mbits/sec 0.787 ms 1132/1233 (92%)
[ 4] 7.01-8.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.976 ms 1121/1221 (92%)
[ 4] 8.01-9.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.54 Mbits/sec 0.886 ms 1120/1220 (92%)
[ 4] 9.01-10.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.886 ms 1121/1221 (92%)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-10.01 sec 97.4 MBytes 81.6 Mbits/sec 0.885 ms 11260/12455 (90%)
[ 4] Sent 12455 datagrams

iperf Done.

Tinuva · Jan 11, 2019

sand_man said:
C:\WINDOWS\system32>iperf3.exe -R -u -b 80M -p 17001 -c queen.cisp.co.za
Connecting to host queen.cisp.co.za, port 17001
Reverse mode, remote host queen.cisp.co.za is sending
[ 4] local 192.168.1.186 port 55118 connected to 62.233.65.195 port 17001
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-1.01 sec 2.18 MBytes 18.1 Mbits/sec 0.897 ms 995/1274 (78%)
[ 4] 1.01-2.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.851 ms 1120/1220 (92%)
[ 4] 2.01-3.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.912 ms 1121/1221 (92%)
[ 4] 3.01-4.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.809 ms 1121/1221 (92%)
[ 4] 4.01-5.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.922 ms 1120/1220 (92%)
[ 4] 5.01-6.01 sec 792 KBytes 6.49 Mbits/sec 0.774 ms 1110/1209 (92%)
[ 4] 6.01-7.01 sec 808 KBytes 6.62 Mbits/sec 0.787 ms 1132/1233 (92%)
[ 4] 7.01-8.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.976 ms 1121/1221 (92%)
[ 4] 8.01-9.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.54 Mbits/sec 0.886 ms 1120/1220 (92%)
[ 4] 9.01-10.01 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.886 ms 1121/1221 (92%)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-10.01 sec 97.4 MBytes 81.6 Mbits/sec 0.885 ms 11260/12455 (90%)
[ 4] Sent 12455 datagrams

iperf Done.

It would be silly, but what if they left the burst at 0 on your line. Then I guess no speed on the iperf3 test will work. It will just smash right into the rate limiter every time.

sand_man · Jan 11, 2019

Tinuva said:
ok lower it further until you find a speed at which it looks better

Microsoft Windows [Version 10.0.17763.253]
(c) 2018 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

C:\WINDOWS\system32>iperf3.exe -R -u -b 40M -p 17001 -c queen.cisp.co.za
Connecting to host queen.cisp.co.za, port 17001
Reverse mode, remote host queen.cisp.co.za is sending
[ 4] local 192.168.1.105 port 63613 connected to 62.233.65.195 port 17001
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 2.48 MBytes 20.8 Mbits/sec 0.202 ms 311/629 (49%)
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 784 KBytes 6.43 Mbits/sec 0.164 ms 512/610 (84%)
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.105 ms 511/611 (84%)
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.074 ms 510/610 (84%)
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.133 ms 510/610 (84%)
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.105 ms 510/610 (84%)
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 776 KBytes 6.35 Mbits/sec 0.079 ms 514/611 (84%)
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.054 ms 510/610 (84%)
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.063 ms 511/611 (84%)
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.082 ms 510/610 (84%)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 48.6 MBytes 40.8 Mbits/sec 0.080 ms 4996/6226 (80%)
[ 4] Sent 6226 datagrams

iperf Done.

C:\WINDOWS\system32>iperf3.exe -R -u -b 20M -p 17001 -c queen.cisp.co.za
Connecting to host queen.cisp.co.za, port 17001
Reverse mode, remote host queen.cisp.co.za is sending
[ 4] local 192.168.1.105 port 51884 connected to 62.233.65.195 port 17001
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 2.48 MBytes 20.8 Mbits/sec 0.086 ms 0/317 (0%)
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 1.46 MBytes 12.2 Mbits/sec 0.111 ms 117/304 (38%)
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.247 ms 206/306 (67%)
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.154 ms 205/305 (67%)
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.214 ms 205/305 (67%)
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.108 ms 205/305 (67%)
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.087 ms 205/305 (67%)
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.105 ms 205/305 (67%)
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.55 Mbits/sec 0.103 ms 206/306 (67%)
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 800 KBytes 6.56 Mbits/sec 0.090 ms 205/305 (67%)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 24.3 MBytes 20.4 Mbits/sec 0.086 ms 1792/3112 (58%)
[ 4] Sent 3112 datagrams

iperf Done.

C:\WINDOWS\system32>iperf3.exe -R -u -b 10M -p 17001 -c queen.cisp.co.za
Connecting to host queen.cisp.co.za, port 17001
Reverse mode, remote host queen.cisp.co.za is sending
[ 4] local 192.168.1.105 port 50875 connected to 62.233.65.195 port 17001
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 1.23 MBytes 10.4 Mbits/sec 0.260 ms 0/158 (0%)
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 1.18 MBytes 9.88 Mbits/sec 0.055 ms 2/153 (1.3%)
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 1.20 MBytes 10.0 Mbits/sec 0.090 ms 0/153 (0%)
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 1.19 MBytes 9.97 Mbits/sec 0.059 ms 0/152 (0%)
iperf3: OUT OF ORDER - incoming packet = 663 and received packet = 664 AND SP = 4
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 1.19 MBytes 9.95 Mbits/sec 0.065 ms 2/153 (1.3%)
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 1.20 MBytes 10.0 Mbits/sec 0.146 ms 0/153 (0%)
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 1.19 MBytes 9.96 Mbits/sec 0.060 ms 0/152 (0%)
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 1.19 MBytes 9.95 Mbits/sec 0.134 ms 1/153 (0.65%)
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 1.19 MBytes 9.96 Mbits/sec 0.078 ms 0/152 (0%)
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 1.20 MBytes 10.0 Mbits/sec 0.109 ms 0/153 (0%)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 12.2 MBytes 10.2 Mbits/sec 0.069 ms 5/1557 (0.32%)
[ 4] Sent 1557 datagrams
[SUM] 0.0-10.0 sec 1 datagrams received out-of-order

iperf Done.

C:\WINDOWS\system32>iperf3.exe -R -u -b 8M -p 17001 -c queen.cisp.co.za
Connecting to host queen.cisp.co.za, port 17001
Reverse mode, remote host queen.cisp.co.za is sending
[ 4] local 192.168.1.105 port 63896 connected to 62.233.65.195 port 17001
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 1008 KBytes 8.25 Mbits/sec 1.883 ms 1/127 (0.79%)
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 976 KBytes 8.00 Mbits/sec 0.221 ms 0/122 (0%)
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 976 KBytes 8.00 Mbits/sec 0.048 ms 0/122 (0%)
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 976 KBytes 7.99 Mbits/sec 0.079 ms 0/122 (0%)
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 976 KBytes 7.99 Mbits/sec 0.074 ms 0/122 (0%)
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 968 KBytes 7.94 Mbits/sec 0.069 ms 1/122 (0.82%)
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 976 KBytes 7.99 Mbits/sec 0.067 ms 0/122 (0%)
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 984 KBytes 8.05 Mbits/sec 0.081 ms 0/123 (0%)
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 976 KBytes 8.00 Mbits/sec 0.110 ms 0/122 (0%)
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 968 KBytes 7.93 Mbits/sec 0.074 ms 0/121 (0%)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Jitter Lost/Total Datagrams
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 9.73 MBytes 8.17 Mbits/sec 0.179 ms 2/1246 (0.16%)
[ 4] Sent 1246 datagrams

iperf Done.

C:\WINDOWS\system32>

sand_man · Jan 11, 2019

Tinuva said:
It would be silly, but what if they left the burst at 0 on your line. Then I guess no speed on the iperf3 test will work. It will just smash right into the rate limiter every time.

Or maybe default is at an entry level of 10Mbps, which would explain why it's fine tested at 8M...

Tinuva · Jan 11, 2019

@sand_man you should send all those through to CISP and ask them to get the line provider to recheck your config.

abudabi · Jan 11, 2019

sand_man said:
Or maybe default is at an entry level of 10Mbps, which would explain why it's fine tested at 8M...

You were originally on 10 and then upgraded.. or am I confusing you with someone else.

sand_man · Jan 11, 2019

You are. I had an ont swap out. I was on 100Mbps and upgraded to 200Mbps...

abudabi said:
You were originally on 10 and then upgraded.. or am I confusing you with someone else.

abudabi · Jan 11, 2019

kk.. there goes that theory then

Praeses · Jan 11, 2019

@PBCool has CISP made any progress on the Frogfoot issue yet or are the gremlins still eluding you guys?

image132 · Jan 11, 2019

Twitch not even pulling 300KB/s again.

Everyone comes back from holiday and I go back to not being able to use Twitch in the evenings. Good to know Octotel have done absolutely nothing.

London (Coreix) Multi-Threaded:

London (Coreix) Single-Threaded:

@PBCool Please tell me you have at least informed Octotel of the issue. I haven't heard anything back from support for over a month now since I submitted my iperf tests.

Denver**** · Jan 11, 2019

image132 said:
View attachment 602094

Twitch not even pulling 300KB/s again.

Everyone comes back from holiday and I go back to not being able to use Twitch in the evenings. Good to know Octotel have done absolutely nothing.

London (Coreix) Multi-Threaded:

London (Coreix) Single-Threaded:

@PBCool Please tell me you have at least informed Octotel of the issue. I haven't heard anything back from support for over a month now since I submitted my iperf tests.

Streaming as a whole is fonked.... freezing and buffering like crazy... and in on Vumatel

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