Mbeki may be right about whites

[xtermin8or]

Yup - we dream that this incompetent govt might one day start performing. Stupid optimists.

Don't forget that a large part of the ex-SADF ( ie: the "apartheid" one ) ( including conscripts ) remain armed thanks to the cheap military surplus firearms made available to us. We might be getting on a little, but I can still field-strip and re-assemble an R1 blindfolded, and you would not want to be firing at me within 400 metres.

Is this some kind of threat ?

 

[Gothan]

@ Gothan - and a host of others who have posted similair ideas

The President, Safety and Security Minister, National Police Commissioner, and a host of other senior officials have all acknowledged that crime is a problem, the falsehood, miscommunication or propaganda that is spread that they believe it is not a problem is just that

Read the President's State of the Nation Address please

The explanation is that Whites and Blacks see crime differently, because of the history in this country, nevertheless Government has put concrete steps in place to counter the problem of crime in this country

Well if you know of this propoganda team, please let me know, cause Iw ould like to go and sort them out. In a previous news article, I have posted, salebi stated that crime was down, and on the exact same day, the safety and security minister said, crime was on the rise, so where is this propoganda machine working now, maybe government should listen to its own (and I mean government here, before somebody jumps up and = own to blacks)

 

[rwenzori]

Is this some kind of threat ?

Nope. Just a statement of fact.

 

[LottaFun]

Ok, so what is your point? That i'm black and therefore can't help but be a criminal? you've just proved my point then. You guys were raised to believe that the black man is inherently criminal. People said that i shouldn't pretend to know how you'all were brouhgt up but here's proof.

What does Nigeria have to do with me or this country? It's mostly black, so is South africa so.......Tah dah!

The point is that colour of your skin has nothing to do with you becomming a criminal or not. It is your choice to work and enjoy a better life or to murder and steal someone else life and belongings.

 

[BobbyMac]

...nevertheless Government has put concrete steps in place to counter the problem of crime in this country

Clearly these steps did not work. Surely the plan should be to eliminate the violence first and foremost? Not just decrease it by 1 or 2 percentage points year on year? Furthermore, countering a problem sort of implies containing the problem rather than eradicating the problem

 

[LottaFun]

Let me ask the simplest of all questions.

Seeing how it is the white people's "fault" that crime is so high, if every white person left SA, would the murders, rapes and robberies stop?

I do not think so. Their is a new breed called the black middle class and as they stated on the tv news, the numbers are rising. Right now it is about
9 000 000. They are being murdered, raped and robbed also.

 

[xtermin8or]

Clearly these steps did not work. Surely the plan should be to eliminate the violence first and foremost? Not just decrease it by 1 or 2 percentage points year on year? Furthermore, countering a problem sort of implies containing the problem rather than eradicating the problem

We will never be able to completely eradicate crime, poverty, violence here or anywhere else on the planet - some of the steps are working ( as proven by the reduction in crime ) and it is an ongoing process whereby strategies are tried and reworked until a solution is found - Rome was not built in a day

 

[Skeptik]

Anctoday website is down. It should be renamed 'SAYesterday'.

 

[McSack]

@ Gothan - and a host of others who have posted similair ideas

The President, Safety and Security Minister, National Police Commissioner, and a host of other senior officials have all acknowledged that crime is a problem, the falsehood, miscommunication or propaganda that is spread that they believe it is not a problem is just that

Read the President's State of the Nation Address please

The explanation is that Whites and Blacks see crime differently, because of the history in this country, nevertheless Government has put concrete steps in place to counter the problem of crime in this country

Gotta disagree with you there bro'. Results of quick straw poll in our little department of 10 (1 white over 30 dude, 1 white under 30 chicken, 1 black under 25 chicken, 2 indian dudes(40+ & under 20) , 5 black dudes ranging in age from 22 to 33)

• all think crime is the biggest problem facing sa at the moment
• all are concerned about the inherent violence of crimes
• all think mbeki is living in dreamworld and the only people he's getting an opinion from are his toadies who also live behind a wall of security paid for by us, and wouldn't disagree with anything he says anyway
• interestingly enough 5 out 9 would want mbeki to stay on as pres.

 

[Sneeky]

The only way to effectively deal with the majority of crime in our wonderful country is to eradicate poverty. This is no easy task and the government has done a lot,and continue to do a lot in this area, through grants and community projects, the growth in the economy, etc.
They deserve a whopping amount of credit for what has been achieved.
They need to do a lot more though and because our borders are wide open, criminal elements are flocking here in droves. This is also fueled by hardship and strife in neighboring states. Put an end to it.

 

[Sneeky]

• interestingly enough 5 out 9 would want mbeki to stay on as pres.

when you look at the alternatives its a no brainer

 

[LottaFun]

The only way to effectively deal with the majority of crime in our wonderful country is to eradicate poverty. This is no easy task and the government has done a lot,and continue to do a lot in this area, through grants and community projects, the growth in the economy, etc.
They deserve a whopping amount of credit for what has been achieved.
They need to do a lot more though and because our borders are wide open, criminal elements are flocking here in droves. This is also fueled by hardship and strife in neighboring states. Put an end to it.

You are soooo right. 6 Million zim guys in SA. We can't even give our own people work. Tons and tons of Nigerians. Close the borders till we get our own house in order. WHoa!!

 

[Vrotappel]

Whenever the issue of crime comes to the front Government will counter it with racism (to shift the focus) or as an apartheid legacy. One of the apartheid legacies are allegedly the economic position in which most black people (I stole because I was hungry) find themselves.

None of which explains to me why we the highest rape figure in thew world. Anybody care to explain what apartheid's influence was here?

 

[noxibox]

Since I've been excluded from the great white racist conspiracy I'm not privy to the great plot to promote the white racist agenda by pretending there is a lot of crime.

 

[Jozi101]

Yup - we dream that this incompetent govt might one day start performing. Stupid optimists.

Don't forget that a large part of the ex-SADF ( ie: the "apartheid" one ) ( including conscripts ) remain armed thanks to the cheap military surplus firearms made available to us. We might be getting on a little, but I can still field-strip and re-assemble an R1 blindfolded, and you would not want to be firing at me within 400 metres.

Boeremag alert!!!!!!!!

Your fellow SADF members tried that and failed dismally, so don't even go there.

 

[xtermin8or]

As Nelson Mandela observed in 1997, we have continued to express our own serious
concern radically to bring down the levels of crime, and have consistently acted
to achieve this result. The fact of unacceptably high levels of crime in our
country is not in dispute. Nevertheless, in the light of what follows, none
among us should be surprised when, as is customary, those who are determined to
avoid confronting the difficult issues we raise in this Letter, seek to divert
attention away from discussing the relationship between racism and the
perception of crime, by falsely and dishonestly claiming that I am trying to
deny or minimise the seriousness of the incidence of crime in our country.

The matter we seek to discuss, in the context of the struggle to create a non-
racial society, is what Nelson Mandela identified as the phenomenon of the re-
emergence of the prophets of doom, who "spread messages about...rampant and
uncontrollable crime", conducting "a massive propaganda campaign...on the issue
of crime, in many instances without any regard and respect for the truth." The
question to ask is - why did this happen then, and why does it continue to
happen now?

The answer is suggested by the question posed by the Mr C we mentioned above,
who asked, anxiously - since they are Black, how do we know they are kosher!
That answer lies in the deeply entrenched racism that has convinced Mr X that
Africans are Cu****es and Edomites, who have since time immemorial, been
repudiated by a God who is only a God of the Whites.

the fact of the matter is that we still have a
significant proportion of people among the white minority, but by no means
everybody who is white, that continues to live in fear of the black, and
especially African majority. For this section of our population, that does not
"find it too difficult to revert to the accustomed world of fear of the future",
every reported incident of crime communicates the frightening and expected
message that - the kaffirs are coming!

The colleague in government to whom I referred, Mr A, posed the rhetorical
question - why are the Whites so determined to frighten themselves! The answer
of course is that they have taken no such decision. Rather, the problem is that
entrenched racism dictates that justification must be found for the persisting
white fears of "die swart gevaar".

All incidents of crime, preferably broadcast as loudly as possible, provide such
justification, as have other issues, such as those mentioned by Nelson Mandela
in 1997, and as the impending victory of the ANC in 2004 was used to incite
white fears that our movement was about to establish a one-party state!

As we observed earlier in this Letter, Dr Mulder said: "We do not know each
other and do not debate with each other. Two minute speeches from this podium
are not debates." Mr Leon said: "as a nation we should spend more time listening
to each other, and not be too quick to judge as illegitimate the concerns and
expressions of any group."

As we celebrate Human Rights Day, it remains to be seen whether we have the will
to know one another and to debate with one another; whether we are willing to
spend more time listening to one another, educating ourselves not be too quick
to judge as illegitimate the concerns and expressions of any group; and whether
we have the courage to engage in a truth and reconciliation process even with
regard to the challenge of openly confronting the cancer of deeply dehumanising
racist stereotypes that developed over many centuries.
The resolve to educate ourselves to not be too quick to judge as illegitimate
the concerns and expressions of any group must include not being too quick to judge as illegitimate the concerns and expressions of the African people, the
historic victims of racism, who remain deeply disturbed that some in positions
of power still think it is normal to speak of them as "kaffirs", and others
among our white compatriots think that it is natural to ask the question - since
they are Black, how do we know they are not criminals!

Excerpts from the Letter

What Mandela said in 1997

The prophets of doom have re-emerged in our country. In 1994, these predicted
that the transition to democracy would be attended by a lot of bloodshed...

"(Now) their task is to spread messages about an impending economic collapse,
escalating corruption in the public service, rampant and uncontrollable crime, a
massive loss of skills through white emigration and mass demoralisation among
the people either because they are white and therefore threatened by the ANC and
its policies which favour black people, or because they are black and
consequently forgotten because the ANC is too busy protecting white privilege.

"A massive propaganda campaign has been conducted on the issue of crime, in many
instances without any regard and respect for the truth. We will ourselves
discuss this matter because of our own serious concern radically to bring down
the levels of crime. However, what is necessary is that anybody genuinely
committed to this goal should make an objective study of this problem and avoid
the serious distortions which result from this exploitation of this issue for
partisan political purposes.

"Such a study for example will show that for Johannesburg, murder, attempted
murder and culpable homicide taken together, have been declining steadily since
1994. Facts and figures actually disprove the notion that there has been a rapid
escalation of these crimes and confirm that we inherited the high levels of
these crimes from the apartheid system."

 

[xtermin8or]

Let me ask the simplest of all questions.

Seeing how it is the white people's "fault" that crime is so high, if every white person left SA, would the murders, rapes and robberies stop?

I do not think so. Their is a new breed called the black middle class and as they stated on the tv news, the numbers are rising. Right now it is about
9 000 000. They are being murdered, raped and robbed also.

Could that be the great fear

 

[BobbyMac]

We will never be able to completely eradicate crime, poverty, violence here or anywhere else on the planet - some of the steps are working ( as proven by the reduction in crime ) and it is an ongoing process whereby strategies are tried and reworked until a solution is found - Rome was not built in a day

At the current rate of decline, it will take 20 years (2 full decades) to bring the murder rate alone down below the 10000 per year figure, and a further 15 years to bring it to under 1000.

After fifty years, at the current rate of decline, Rape would be just below 40000 per year. It will take around 180 years to bring the rape rate on par with Italy. Rome may not have been built in a day, but it sure didn't take 180 years either...

The point that I'm trying to make is this: Crime is not being dealt with in any suitable way. There are serious challenges in this regard, so instead of pointing fingers and trying to appropriate blame and shift focus on other issues, deal with the damn problem. Then you may stroke your cockatoo in public about how wonderful you are as a government.

 

[Slooth]

I'm an African and I'm white ;o)

 

[xtermin8or]

At the current rate of decline, it will take 20 years (2 full decades) to bring the murder rate alone down below the 10000 per year figure, and a further 15 years to bring it to under 1000.

After fifty years, at the current rate of decline, Rape would be just below 40000 per year. It will take around 180 years to bring the rape rate on par with Italy. Rome may not have been built in a day, but it sure didn't take 180 years either...

The point that I'm trying to make is this: Crime is not being dealt with in any suitable way. There are serious challenges in this regard, so instead of pointing fingers and trying to appropriate blame and shift focus on other issues, deal with the damn problem. Then you may stroke your cockatoo in public about how wonderful you are as a government.

Which part of strategies are reworked until an effective solution is found, did you not understand ?