Uncapped ADSL: The solution for bandwidth hogs

[Necuno]

Did you read through my replies to your points?

While I admitted that for some of them the wug won't help you at all, and while I agree that there are some downloads that people won't be sharing (private beta for a game, licensed MSDN software, etc) a lot of the other software can be shared and will help other users.

Just like you flip out and become very upset about the fact that your fair usage of ADSL is considered "abusive" I resent your implication that the wug is only useful for one thing.

It is not. We use it for lots of amazing services, including VOIP, lots of gaming, wug hosted websites with forums, patch mirrors, linux repositories and so forth.

It is also a great testing ground for new ideas, every now and then someone will run a service that people can test, something that he would have had to rent a dedicated server in order to test on the internet.

So stop trying to do to the wug what ISPs are doing to you. Your usage of your uncapped account is legit, yet the ISP claims it is abusive. Don't go and claim the same about wugs please

i did read it. in short you said: wug is leet for local, but not useful when trying to do the same things internationally.

Wug NO:

1. Steam
2. Direct 2 drive
3. Legit msdn iso and training
4. Vpn to work, international sites
5. Xlive content
6. Conferencing to international
7. Uploading of work done to international clients
8. Digital distribution of other bought media
9. Mmo with voip
10. RDP to overseas sites
11. VM deployment to data centers
12. Closed beta (yes those invite onlies)
13. Indie testing
14. Assistance in game development

this like a press release for wug ?

i'm curious how wug for example is going to help with:

a little education for those who can't seem to grasp the concept that some of us actually really use the internet for other things than what they would normally associate usage with. however i suppose i can't really blame them if that is the only exposure they have been exposed to and automatically go ZOMG series, movies, games and applications when confronted with a lot of bandwidth or can't seem to realize how some other people are using more than what they would consider normal. clearly most or and some other people just don't know what else is out there imho...

...to the usage.
steam - anything from 500 meg up to 10 gig and even more per game title legally bought.

Nope, wug cannot help there. I have been thinking of setting up a webafrica adsl account with access to WAGE and routing traffic to and from it over the wug. But the adsl line will be a rather huge bottleneck.

ign - patches, demos, previews and clips of mostly games. also can get quite huge thinking of nowadays demos weighing in at least 1gig+. not to forget HD streams and so on from them.

There are a lot of HD previews and lots of demos on the wug. You just need one guy to download it and all the rest can enjoy them too.

direct 2 drive - mostly same idea as steam. buy a game and download it directly, aslo anything from 500 meg up to 10 gig.

Nope, sorry. Cannot help there.

beta testing of games - yep online testing of coming mmos and even some other non mmo developers does this. anything from 2 to 5+ gig a shot. then there will also be the constant patches and content being added to the beta testing.

test clients (mmo) - some of us likes to play around on the test clients of mmos and that too can get a lot to download at times. the test client which normally equals the non-test client (5+ gig) and as well as the patches and content being added and removed on a more than normal basis.

I have seen a few beta clients of MMO games on the wug. Star Trek Online, AION, WoW patches, etc. It is not as fast as downloading it yourself, but you can get it for free if someone else also happens to enjoy MMO games.

msdn/technet training - anything from 50-250meg a video can get quite a lot when you go though a few courses being presented.

msdn software - same as with beta/test clients if you go for application testing and excluding the released applications. normally from 1-3+ gigs. for releases software, well the normal sizes it would be like around 3 gig for windows 7.

Have seen a few of this on the wug. Lots of technical people on the wug, so if one of them downloads a beta, RC or training videos he can share it.

vpn to work - just add a normal day of network traffic, documents you might work on and everything else that needs to be seen and worked on to complete an 8 hour day of work or less. also throw in some server administration and maybe some reporting on the side too, not to mention if you have to pull and push large files over the vpn.

Won't help you with overseas links, but you can set up a vpn between two computers on the wug. Make of that what you want...

HD streams via xbox - it starts at 2 gig a flick, goes up to 5/6 gig for proper HD flick via xlive. this does not include the total pay tv series you can get via sky i think. there is also the getting games with their direct 2 console thing. slap any released xbox game onto that which easily weighs in at around 7 gigs.

Nope.

video conferencing - anyone who have done a bit of proper video conferencing know that it takes a lot of content in size.

Over the wug it is possible, we sometimes have teamspeak meetings on the wug too. Not of any use if you need to chat with someone not on the wug.

upload of work - try doing some digital painting and design for someone in a foreign country, trust me uploading each set of raws can get really huge.

Wug cannot help here.

...and this is not even all of the things one could do to really use your bandwidth. bit tiresome of when some go ZOMG you must be pirate, how else can you use 50-150 gig a month ? or lol the isp geez these ****ers must only be into pirating since they decided they actually want to use our product and not just go some oom and tannie via facebook.


Update to list
Voicy -
game development videos - 60-100mb each

These videos can be shared over the wug.

Pilgrim -
Online stores that sell digital copies, eg Amazon, Audible, iTunes (need international account for that, but possible) etc.

Nope.

MMO with VOIP - over 3 gigs for w/e

No use for you and your overseas friends, but if you and a few other wuggers play together you can teamspeak for free, thus saving bandwidth.

warchylde -
Citrix - RDP tool when working from home
SIP/AIX (VOIP) - VOIP connectivity to Office PBX (this can be quite a hog)

Wug cannot help here, unless both the work and home are on the wug. We don't want people to use the wug for work related tasks though.

Linux Distros
Linux Distro updates everytime a VM is reinstalled (between 450GMB and 1.5GB depending on what's installed)

There are linux mirrors on the wug (2 i think)

Uploading of VM's to a datacentre.

Won't help here though.

Microsoft updates for test servers (no indication of amount.)

There is a WSUS server on the wug. (Microsoft update server)

Also, we are experimenting with anti virus update servers too.

As can be seen, the wug can actually help you quite a lot. It is what you make of it.

 

[Anthro]

I am hogging their services,but I am yet to sign up with a 'uncapped' provider.
Currently paying for every bit of information that I acquire - R19/gig IIRC since my last purchase of bandwidth.
Uncapped providers need to go and get their terminology sorted, according to the 'internet dictionary' uncapped is not defined as throttled and shaped - or limited in any way.
Full taps all the way, end.

 

[JerryMungo]

[citation needed]

I've never seen any evidence of throttling on mweb uncapped, feel free to produce some.

http://mybroadband.co.za/photos/showphoto.php/photo/15413/title/download-speed/cat/all

It's not new and been discussed before. It's consistently at 7am that I see that little graph in grabit

 

[Pilgrim]

i did read it. in short you said: wug is leet for local, but not useful when trying to do the same things internationally.

No, A lot of the content on the wug comes from international, eg Microsoft WSUS content, Linux mirrors, game updates, demos, previews etc...

What the wug does not do is replace your internet for you. It does compliment your internet.

I do however resent the fact that you claim the wug is only good for piracy. That is utter bul****.

 

[Necuno]

No, A lot of the content on the wug comes from international, eg Microsoft WSUS content, Linux mirrors, game updates, demos, previews etc...

What the wug does not do is replace your internet for you. It does compliment your internet.

I do however resent the fact that you claim the wug is only good for piracy. That is utter bul****.

i've added the bits i do use internet for which wug doesn't cater for to assist your comprehension . this is also why it is not the solution as the article says is for "hogs" because it is the writer of the article who suggest that wug is also a piracy heaven as the hogs per the article is typical p2p users...

...please go place your shant and the writers door, i'm going what he/she/it reported and your reply of everything being available.

Did you read through my replies to your points?

While I admitted that for some of them the wug won't help you at all, and while I agree that there are some downloads that people won't be sharing (private beta for a game, licensed MSDN software, etc) a lot of the other software can be shared and will help other users.

Just like you flip out and become very upset about the fact that your fair usage of ADSL is considered "abusive" I resent your implication that the wug is only useful for one thing.

It is not. We use it for lots of amazing services, including VOIP, lots of gaming, wug hosted websites with forums, patch mirrors, linux repositories and so forth.

It is also a great testing ground for new ideas, every now and then someone will run a service that people can test, something that he would have had to rent a dedicated server in order to test on the internet.

So stop trying to do to the wug what ISPs are doing to you. Your usage of your uncapped account is legit, yet the ISP claims it is abusive. Don't go and claim the same about wugs please

i did read it. in short you said: wug is leet for local, but not useful when trying to do the same things internationally.

Wug NO:

1. Steam
2. Direct 2 drive
3. Legit msdn iso and training
4. Vpn to work, international sites
5. Xlive content
6. Conferencing to international
7. Uploading of work done to international clients
8. Digital distribution of other bought media
9. Mmo with voip
10. RDP to overseas sites
11. VM deployment to data centers
12. Closed beta (yes those invite onlies)
13. Indie testing
14. Assistance in game development

this like a press release for wug ?

i'm curious how wug for example is going to help with:

a little education for those who can't seem to grasp the concept that some of us actually really use the internet for other things than what they would normally associate usage with. however i suppose i can't really blame them if that is the only exposure they have been exposed to and automatically go ZOMG series, movies, games and applications when confronted with a lot of bandwidth or can't seem to realize how some other people are using more than what they would consider normal. clearly most or and some other people just don't know what else is out there imho...

...to the usage.
steam - anything from 500 meg up to 10 gig and even more per game title legally bought.

Nope, wug cannot help there. I have been thinking of setting up a webafrica adsl account with access to WAGE and routing traffic to and from it over the wug. But the adsl line will be a rather huge bottleneck.

ign - patches, demos, previews and clips of mostly games. also can get quite huge thinking of nowadays demos weighing in at least 1gig+. not to forget HD streams and so on from them.

There are a lot of HD previews and lots of demos on the wug. You just need one guy to download it and all the rest can enjoy them too.

direct 2 drive - mostly same idea as steam. buy a game and download it directly, aslo anything from 500 meg up to 10 gig.

Nope, sorry. Cannot help there.

beta testing of games - yep online testing of coming mmos and even some other non mmo developers does this. anything from 2 to 5+ gig a shot. then there will also be the constant patches and content being added to the beta testing.

test clients (mmo) - some of us likes to play around on the test clients of mmos and that too can get a lot to download at times. the test client which normally equals the non-test client (5+ gig) and as well as the patches and content being added and removed on a more than normal basis.

I have seen a few beta clients of MMO games on the wug. Star Trek Online, AION, WoW patches, etc. It is not as fast as downloading it yourself, but you can get it for free if someone else also happens to enjoy MMO games.

msdn/technet training - anything from 50-250meg a video can get quite a lot when you go though a few courses being presented.

msdn software - same as with beta/test clients if you go for application testing and excluding the released applications. normally from 1-3+ gigs. for releases software, well the normal sizes it would be like around 3 gig for windows 7.

Have seen a few of this on the wug. Lots of technical people on the wug, so if one of them downloads a beta, RC or training videos he can share it.

vpn to work - just add a normal day of network traffic, documents you might work on and everything else that needs to be seen and worked on to complete an 8 hour day of work or less. also throw in some server administration and maybe some reporting on the side too, not to mention if you have to pull and push large files over the vpn.

Won't help you with overseas links, but you can set up a vpn between two computers on the wug. Make of that what you want...

HD streams via xbox - it starts at 2 gig a flick, goes up to 5/6 gig for proper HD flick via xlive. this does not include the total pay tv series you can get via sky i think. there is also the getting games with their direct 2 console thing. slap any released xbox game onto that which easily weighs in at around 7 gigs.

Nope.

video conferencing - anyone who have done a bit of proper video conferencing know that it takes a lot of content in size.

Over the wug it is possible, we sometimes have teamspeak meetings on the wug too. Not of any use if you need to chat with someone not on the wug.

upload of work - try doing some digital painting and design for someone in a foreign country, trust me uploading each set of raws can get really huge.

Wug cannot help here.

...and this is not even all of the things one could do to really use your bandwidth. bit tiresome of when some go ZOMG you must be pirate, how else can you use 50-150 gig a month ? or lol the isp geez these ****ers must only be into pirating since they decided they actually want to use our product and not just go some oom and tannie via facebook.


Update to list
Voicy -
game development videos - 60-100mb each

These videos can be shared over the wug.

Pilgrim -
Online stores that sell digital copies, eg Amazon, Audible, iTunes (need international account for that, but possible) etc.

Nope.

MMO with VOIP - over 3 gigs for w/e

No use for you and your overseas friends, but if you and a few other wuggers play together you can teamspeak for free, thus saving bandwidth.

warchylde -
Citrix - RDP tool when working from home
SIP/AIX (VOIP) - VOIP connectivity to Office PBX (this can be quite a hog)

Wug cannot help here, unless both the work and home are on the wug. We don't want people to use the wug for work related tasks though.

Linux Distros
Linux Distro updates everytime a VM is reinstalled (between 450GMB and 1.5GB depending on what's installed)

There are linux mirrors on the wug (2 i think)

Uploading of VM's to a datacentre.

Won't help here though.

Microsoft updates for test servers (no indication of amount.)

There is a WSUS server on the wug. (Microsoft update server)

Also, we are experimenting with anti virus update servers too.

As can be seen, the wug can actually help you quite a lot. It is what you make of it.

 

[AntiThesis]

It's not new and been discussed before. It's consistently at 7am that I see that little graph in grabit

I'm sure then that someone has explained that shaping != throttling.

Anyway - what about East London? I'd like to look at the idea of a WUG but if there isn't one here there's not too much point. And if there is one here I imagine there are two guys on it max

 

[JvanD]

So far I haven't seen any suggestions on throtteling P2P nor NNTP servers.
Doubt if anything can be enforced.

 

[Pilgrim]

i've added the bits i do use internet for which wug doesn't cater for to assist your comprehension . this is also why it is not the solution as the article says is for "hogs" because it is the writer of the article who suggest that wug is also a piracy heaven as the hogs per the article is typical p2p users...

...please go place your shant and the writers door, i'm going what he/she/it reported and your reply of everything being available.

I agree with your points. There are loads of situations where the wug will be useless to you. I understand where you are coming from now

What irks me is the general assumption that if anyone is using a lot of bandwidth you must be using it for illegal purposes. That is total BS, but I suppose some people will never see reason :wtf:

What I did try to point out is it is surprising how much you can actually do with the wug, but it is not enough. Not yet anyway

 

[Necuno]

I agree with your points. There are loads of situations where the wug will be useless to you. I understand where you are coming from now

What irks me is the general assumption that if anyone is using a lot of bandwidth you must be using it for illegal purposes. That is total BS, but I suppose some people will never see reason :wtf:

What I did try to point out is it is surprising how much you can actually do with the wug, but it is not enough. Not yet anyway

Look i'm quite sure that wug in its "limits" is awesome as it should be, but i agree that it is getting old to say that Usage == Piracy == Hog. Seriously get out under rock.

 

[daffy]

Okay, a few things.

1) WUGS are unstable. Thats what happens when the control of a network is decentralized and the users run the whole show.
2) Some people think getting on the WUG is hard work. I see this as a good thing. Think of it as a competency test. If you can't figure it out, you probably shouldn't be on the WUG.
3) WUGS don't have coverage everywhere. Don't be afraid to create the coverage, thats how the whole thing started.
4) Content on the WUG is put there by the users. ie: The WUG is what you make of it.

Despite all these things, I love the WUG!
Who cares if its down for a few hours, or a few days. Its not like I'm doing any business-critical traffic over it (and thats exactly why the WUGs won't let you).
I had to create my own WUG coverage... (gross understatement, but you get where I'm going with this).
Personally, I provide an IRC server that people on the WUG can connect to. My IRC Server uses my ADSL line to connect to the main WUG IRC Server. So that lets people on the WUG chat with other WUGgers, even if they have no internet access.

You learn _alot_ from the WUG if you get involved. Jawug's infrastructure is built the same way an ISP would built a network, using the same concepts, technologies and methods. Its great for messing about, learning and experimenting.

Great Article... Letting the masses know that the WUG isn't the Internet, but its complimentary...

 

[bierman]

Where can I get second hand kit?

sign on on the wug site tha i profided and speak to some of the people in the shoutbox, a lot of them uprade tier systems and then sell their old part or u can call the seller who sell the kits and as if they do provide that service

 

[bierman]

+1 What the hell do you think is going to happen if you sell "Uncapped" I mean WTF? Wake up and sell the coffee. Uncapped means no limits. If you can't sell what you advertise then don't advertise that! I don't even use Bit Torrent or P2P, My main source of Downloads is from Hotfile and RapidShare and as far as I know these are http traffic, yet i find myself constantly throttled.

Its not the consumers fault if the ISP's can't cope with the influx of users! Afrihost particularly!

if u want business class uncapped then why dont you just aply for it its R2000 odd a month and u not restricted in any way, if u wanna pay R500 a month then unfortunatly u gona have to settle for second best ( or less then ) its just how life works, and like the ads say its uncapped, u can download x amount as per the ISP's codition they have the right to bring down yr speed but not disconnect u from it. if you not happy about the condition then look for a ISP that doesnt have those condition, u might be happier off then with them

 

[pkid]

if u want business class uncapped then why dont you just aply for it its R2000 odd a month and u not restricted in any way, if u wanna pay R500 a month then unfortunatly u gona have to settle for second best ( or less then ) its just how life works, and like the ads say its uncapped, u can download x amount as per the ISP's codition they have the right to bring down yr speed but not disconnect u from it. if you not happy about the condition then look for a ISP that doesnt have those condition, u might be happier off then with them

+1

 

[LFX]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: the term "bandwidth hog" holds absolutely no ground on the internet, because users who supposedly 'hog' bandwidth PAY for a service, they pay for said service with limitations and if they use it to it's fullest capacity within these limits then it is paid for, you cannot hog something that you have paid for... it's only when you are supposed to share something that it becomes relevant... e.g. on a lan

the real problem here is bloody high contention ratios!

 

[daffy]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: the term "bandwidth hog" holds absolutely no ground on the internet, because users who supposedly 'hog' bandwidth PAY for a service, they pay for said service with limitations and if they use it to it's fullest capacity within these limits then it is paid for, you cannot hog something that you have paid for... it's only when you are supposed to share something that it becomes relevant... e.g. on a lan

the real problem here is bloody high contention ratios!

No, the real problem is that you're expecting an uncontended product.
You're paying for a contended product, so thats what you get. But you are a "hog", because you're expecting to be able to use it at 100% of full capacity all the time. Thats not fair on the other users you're contending with.

You're thinking like a BMW driver. Its your road, and you'll drive however you want. Screw the other drivers.
Its not your road, there are other drivers, and they have just as much right to the road as you do.

 

[stormy]

Rejoice all Uncapped BROWSING have arrived!
Im sorry but ADSL in RSA is still ill.
Any uncapped business model that expect a user to use max 6 gig * R30 wholesale = R180 is ridiculous.
Any more than that your a bandwidth hog that need to be throttled and need to receive hatemail from the ISP.
Thats bull*#&^&.
The word UNCAPPED. UN- meaning "No, none, f**$kall" capped.
Not uncapped browsing but NO utube, no streaming, no skype, no downloads please. Kindly just browse news sites.
I think the ASA need to grab into this false advertising of "uncapped".

..and kindly stop comparing our uncapped with international uncapped which looks at least at 60gig throttling etc.

 

[protzkrog]

You're thinking like a BMW driver

*taxi driver

 

[ponder]

*Sigh*

Please note that this is a tongue in cheek column about the battle uncapped ADSL providers have with so-called ‘bandwidth hogs’.

 

[Fearl3$$]

where can I find out more about WUGs, and especially info on how to connect to one?
In simple English. WUGs for Dummies

www.wug.za.net (Wug site where you can find other wug related sites)
www.ptawug.za.net (Pretoria wug)
www.jawug.za.net (Joburg Wug)
www.cptwug.za.net (Capetown Wug)

Wug is nice when you have LOS of a High Sight... But You still need your internet "Bandwidth hogs" to put stuff on to the Wug's..
If you are a network guy and like to "play" arround with stuff and server type setups then it is also a Cool enviroment to do Testing.

 

[sutekj]

Just stop pirating...or prosecute people who pirate stuff. Traffic from home users would fall 90%. Why should we subsidise people who want to steal?

Go troll somewhere else, thanks.