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Maybe im missing the point here. I dont see how you can have an UNCAPPED account and have excessive use issues IF you arent fooling the shaper? I mean if you stay within the shapers requirements then arent you getting what you paid for, an uncapped account? If i download a maximum of 20 gb that month, my isp isnt going to give me a pat on the head and thank me for not exploiting the system.
 
Chaos247 said:
Maybe im missing the point here. I dont see how you can have an UNCAPPED account and have excessive use issues IF you arent fooling the shaper? I mean if you stay within the shapers requirements then arent you getting what you paid for, an uncapped account? If i download a maximum of 20 gb that month, my isp isnt going to give me a pat on the head and thank me for not exploiting the system.
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You are missing the point of our gist :(

No one is trying to fool the shaper, we are just questioning their window limits. It seems that it's impossible to use the product and not exceed the window limit which would result in a warning email. Not sure how more simple I can put it :o

This is also the reason why I've included a real world example in my previous posts:

1) I'm using 4 meg uncapped product of web africa
2) It has a hourly rolling window of 3.165 GB (weekly of 44-something-gb)
3) I buy myself something of steam, but it's a 10 gig or more download
4) I proceed to download and exceed my hourly download window by almost 3 times
5) I'm put in the "exceeding window" for 7 days which includes speed throttling
6) After 7 days I'd be out of it, however:
6A) I have to update my games, my OS, my iphone, my Pods or want to catch up with my anime.
6B) I proceed to download, but it's somehow over 3.165 GB and I've again exceeded my window limit.
6C) I wait till download+, I hope those are not inclusive of window and would not count towards it. (Would I now be forced to wait till each download+ window if I want to use it ?)

Seems that you will be at least one over your limit or more a month which brings to mind the following questions:

How many strikes in a month does it take?
How many months with strikes in them does it take?

Another problem is when you have more than one user. It's marketed as a home uncapped, homes has families in them or at least two partners. Like for example myself and my partner we both have steam and origin, but now comes into play different mmos and they do need from time to time content updates part normal updates which can easily go over the rolling window. Not to forget streaming of proper HD content or what if we buy two different games at same time ?

Maybe part of the problem is just that I'm thinking that when you overstep your hourly limit you are automatically in a 7 day window? Still going back to my example of steam and origin, taking 2 games which is both above 10 gig, that makes it 6 strikes... will that give me a warning email? will that put me in more than 7 day rolling window? I'm thinking at least few days of worth of downloading there that could easily be seen as "excessive" while you were actually just using your line without going for 24.7...

Now I hope that clearly your questions up.

:edit
Here go after relooking at the UAP :o

Usage Management:
We use a 2 tiered rolling window system between 6am and 12am to ensure our network is optimised to keep our customers’ accounts running smoothly.

If a User uses more than a certain amount of Gigs in a 6 hour period, then their service will be moved to a lower priority until those 6 hours are up. Their ADSL account will then be restored to normal priority.

Similarly, if a User uses more than a certain amount of Gigs in a 7 day period, then their service will be moved to a lower priority until that 7 day period is up. Their ADSL account will then be restored to normal priority.
Click to expand...

So lets take 2 games games at 15gigs each, about 20 hours needing for download (1.5 gig an hour). which means that you have overstep the 3.165 GB by 9.478672985781991 times.

6 hours per 9.478672985781991 times results in a 56.87203791469194 hour window. (±2.37 days).

Now what happens in those ±2.37 days I need another update? What if that update is more than 3.165 GB gigs, or what if total surfing + videos + music is more than 3.165 GB ?
 
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Pr⊕phet said:
6C) I wait till download+, I hope those are not inclusive of window and would not count towards it.
Click to expand...

Download+ = 0am-6am? No, it does not count as part of your window. Think of time as 6am - midnight and then it's 6am again.
 
Pr⊕phet said:
You are missing the point of our gist :(

No one is trying to fool the shaper, we are just questioning their window limits. It seems that it's impossible to use the product and not exceed the window limit which would result in a warning email. Not sure how more simple I can put it :o

This is also the reason why I've included a real world example in my previous posts:

1) I'm using 4 meg uncapped product of web africa
2) It has a hourly rolling window of 3.165 GB (weekly of 44-something-gb)
3) I buy myself something of steam, but it's a 10 gig or more download
4) I proceed to download and exceed my hourly download window by almost 3 times
5) I'm put in the "exceeding window" for 7 days which includes speed throttling
6) After 7 days I'd be out of it, however:
6A) I have to update my games, my OS, my iphone, my Pods or want to catch up with my anime.
6B) I proceed to download, but it's somehow over 3.165 GB and I've again exceeded my window limit.
6C) I wait till download+, I hope those are not inclusive of window and would not count towards it. (Would I now be forced to wait till each download+ window if I want to use it ?)

Seems that you will be at least one over your limit or more a month which brings to mind the following questions:

How many strikes in a month does it take?
How many months with strikes in them does it take?

Another problem is when you have more than one user. It's marketed as a home uncapped, homes has families in them or at least two partners. Like for example myself and my partner we both have steam and origin, but now comes into play different mmos and they do need from time to time content updates part normal updates which can easily go over the rolling window. Not to forget streaming of proper HD content or what if we buy two different games at same time ?

Maybe part of the problem is just that I'm thinking that when you overstep your hourly limit you are automatically in a 7 day window? Still going back to my example of steam and origin, taking 2 games which is both above 10 gig, that makes it 6 strikes... will that give me a warning email? will that put me in more than 7 day rolling window? I'm thinking at least few days of worth of downloading there that could easily be seen as "excessive" while you were actually just using your line without going for 24.7...

Now I hope that clearly your questions up.
Click to expand...

It does. Thanks. What i was trying to say is that it appears that some isps give you a donkey punch and expect you to like it. :wtf:
 
Pr⊕phet said:
Just a little bit concerned how well this product fairs with usage of digital distribution. I can't think of any recent game that is less than 5 gig download and it might be a problem with "Home Uncapped 4Mbps - 6 hours - 3.165 GB". However you did say constantly exceeding, so I guess it be fine if you exceed it three times in a month to get your games.

Downloads in download plus times is exempted from the rolling? This was mentioned earlier afaik.

Because coming back to steam for example, I buy myself skyrim which is about 6gb and downloading that exceeds my download window, but now I want to catch up on some of my anime. This however is queued for download+ hours.... But I'm in a window until 7 days is passed, I guess that would be fine?

Worst thing I can think of is not being able to play having to wait until download+ hours to update all my games or my pc or pods for my iPhone.

There in lies what I'm not sure of, that was why I asked what is excessive. Because currently I can't see how I can use WA Uncapped without at least being excessive more than one time a month. Which means that you have 4 strikes in a month (7 days) which cuts it pretty close...

Does each month being excessive count up? What if I had to download something big once and then now I'm over? 3 months in a row == email ?

Read and understood as:

1) stay in your window.
2) don't fool the shaper.


Thanks for answering and good luck with that.
Click to expand...

We won't just cut you off for no good reason. If you're doing 1Tb a month we'll need to talk ;)
Sorry for only replying here now btw, had a lot on my plate to finalise and sort out.

Regardless of whether or not you're over your threshold, Download Plus hours count as a "free for all"
The Uncapped accounts will de-prioritise non-essential protocols during business like P2P, NNTP etc.

What you're saying is correct, the absolute safe route with our accounts is to stay in the threshold guidelines and don't bypass shaping devices. If this does happen on an excessive level we'll email you with a heads up on things. At this stage, we can't give you exact figures on what is constituted as abuse and what is not.
 
WAJeff said:
We won't just cut you off for no good reason. If you're doing 1Tb a month we'll need to talk ;)
Sorry for only replying here now btw, had a lot on my plate to finalise and sort out.

Regardless of whether or not you're over your threshold, Download Plus hours count as a "free for all"
The Uncapped accounts will de-prioritise non-essential protocols during business like P2P, NNTP etc.

What you're saying is correct, the absolute safe route with our accounts is to stay in the threshold guidelines and don't bypass shaping devices. If this does happen on an excessive level we'll email you with a heads up on things. At this stage, we can't give you exact figures on what is constituted as abuse and what is not.
Click to expand...

Thanks, but I'd have to send you a pm ;)
 
Pr⊕phet said:
...So lets take 2 games games at 15gigs each, about 20 hours needing for download (1.5 gig an hour). which means that you have overstep the 3.165 GB by 9.478672985781991 times.

6 hours per 9.478672985781991 times results in a 56.87203791469194 hour window. (±2.37 days).
Click to expand...

:confused: Not exactly sure what you're doing there. The 6-hour threshold always just looks at the last six hours of usage. So if you downloaded your games @ 1.5GB/hour and then just stopped everything when it's done, your 6-hour threshold will be in the green again about 4 hours after you've stopped since the last (out of DL+) 6 hours should show 3GB downloaded. Same goes for 7-day window.

Either way it's still too easy, in my opinion, to exceed your thresholds. I'm on a 1meg and if I want to download a couple of 350MB episodes when I get home after work (maybe I forgot to download them during DL+ and I want to watch them asap or whatever) and play online a bit later that evening I basically can't since I more than likely exceeded the 6hour window and then everything crawls.
 
WAJeff said:
We won't just cut you off for no good reason. If you're doing 1Tb a month we'll need to talk ;)
Sorry for only replying here now btw, had a lot on my plate to finalise and sort out.

Regardless of whether or not you're over your threshold, Download Plus hours count as a "free for all"
The Uncapped accounts will de-prioritise non-essential protocols during business like P2P, NNTP etc.

What you're saying is correct, the absolute safe route with our accounts is to stay in the threshold guidelines and don't bypass shaping devices. If this does happen on an excessive level we'll email you with a heads up on things. At this stage, we can't give you exact figures on what is constituted as abuse and what is not.
Click to expand...

Just so i understand you correctly.

100mb could be the difference between cancelling your account or letting it slide? Since there isnt a line thats been drawn, no one really knows if they cross it? What i fail to see and this is with every isp not just WA, is that if the account is uncapped and you're shaping, focus on the people that are bypassing and nail them. People that are downloading 24/7 are using the product as advertised since they are bound by your shaping protocols. So following the rules gets you trouble? Then you get reprimanded for breaking rules that haven’t been defined?

If I have paid for a 10mb line and an uncapped account, what grounds do you have to tell me that 1tb is too much? I’ve paid for the service, so im using it. As long as i stay withing the protocals. its all above board.

Uncapped ADSL refers to an ADSL account that has no limit to the amount of data that can be downloaded for that line speed. Am I wrong in understanding the general definition?

I know your answer will include or be based on AUP but the truth is you cant really define your AUP because it will turn an uncapped account into a capped account.

Get to the people that are abusing the system. Applying a blanket approach is going to cost you in the end.

P.S I am a potential customer, this is the general impression thats been put out there.
 
Joe_the_GR8 said:
:confused: Not exactly sure what you're doing there. The 6-hour threshold always just looks at the last six hours of usage. So if you downloaded your games @ 1.5GB/hour and then just stopped everything when it's done, your 6-hour threshold will be in the green again about 4 hours after you've stopped since the last (out of DL+) 6 hours should show 3GB downloaded. Same goes for 7-day window.
Click to expand...
Well it does read as
If a User uses more than a certain amount of Gigs in a 6 hour period, then their service will be moved to a lower priority until those 6 hours are up. Their ADSL account will then be restored to normal priority.
Click to expand...
So then question is just once off 6 hours or 6 hours per violation?

Joe_the_GR8 said:
Either way it's still too easy, in my opinion, to exceed your thresholds. I'm on a 1meg and if I want to download a couple of 350MB episodes when I get home after work (maybe I forgot to download them during DL+ and I want to watch them asap or whatever) and play online a bit later that evening I basically can't since I more than likely exceeded the 6hour window and then everything crawls.
Click to expand...
I think it should be at least double, but actually triple on the hourly rate.
 
Pr⊕phet said:
Well it does read as

So then question is just once off 6 hours or 6 hours per violation?

I think it should be at least double, but actually triple on the hourly rate.
Click to expand...

Once off ;) System only monitors last 6 hours and last 7 days.
 
Chaos247 said:
Uncapped ADSL refers to an ADSL account that has no limit to the amount of data that can be downloaded for that line speed. Am I wrong in understanding the general definition?
Click to expand...

Uncapped is suppose to mean no cap, but the buzzword these days for ISP's is uncapped. So they will brand it as such even thou its not really. Think of it more as after hours uncapped, since between 12 and 6 am is really the only time you can use it as a uncapped service.
 
FreddyB said:
Uncapped is suppose to mean no cap, but the buzzword these days for ISP's is uncapped. So they will brand it as such even thou its not really. Think of it more as after hours uncapped, since between 12 and 6 am is really the only time you can use it as a uncapped service.
Click to expand...

Yes but if you exceed an unknown amount of downloaded data, they'll either cancel your account or warn you for using the account as advertised.
 
Chaos247 said:
Yes but if you exceed an unknown amount of downloaded data, they'll either cancel your account or warn you for using the account as advertised.
Click to expand...

This is the simple system I've devised to stay out of their "abuse" list. I'm on the 1mb line, so I have 11GB Limit in my 7 day rolling window. Thus 11/7 is about 1.5GB a day. Now you have the 800MB in 6 hour limit to consider, so use the first 750mb after 6am and then in the afternoon when I get back from work its 6 hours later so I then use up the remaining 750mb till midnight.
 
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FreddyB said:
This is the simple system I've devised to stay out of their "abuse" list. I'm on the 1mb line, so I have 11GB Limit in my 7 day rolling window. Thus 11/7 is about 1.5GB a day. Now you have the 800MB in 6 hour limit to consider, so use the first 750mb after 6am and then in the afternoon when I get back from work its 6 hours later so I then use up the remaining 750mb till midnight.
Click to expand...


Im glad that you've figured out how to stay within limits but what you're talking about is using an uncapped account as a capped account of 1.5gb a day, although im being charged uncapped account prices. This is heading into a breach of contract territory… but wait, unleash the AUP. Funny though because the AUP is a self sustaining entity that needs no definition or boundaries. It can change shape and apply its self at will. yet we are still waiting for proof of its existence.
 
You Tube is ... so ... so ... slowwwwwwww today.

BF3 on the other hand is great at 30 - 60ms depending on which server.
 
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