Wiring distributuion box

Damac10 said:
Lol. Happened to me too. Then tile s started lifting to boot. House tripping main on street so had to call municipality to switch on..Voets toets needs to change
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You could sue them for the bull**** certificate, the tiles not so much though.
 
Swa said:
You're talking to people here who are the original inventors of ethernet over powerline. Except that we didn't have computers back then and the only use of it was to send morse code to your next door friend. Really we did a lot more unsafe stuff experimenting like to wire mains transformers backwards. If more people familiarised themselves with electricity and what is dangerous there would be less accidents. I know how to do the wiring, google tells me where I should do it. There is a big difference between the two and which one is the dangerous one, if you don't know why I asked the specific questions I did it's not a reflection of my knowledge.


Actually in the states you DO pump your own fuel. In SA it's done for you as a convenience just like packing groceries (don't tell me it's done for you because you wouldn't know how) but also because of theft. I would welcome inserting my card to pay and then pump my own but I guess that will only happen if we change the regs and unions.


LOL good point. Luckily the one in the house besides me is my mom and she wouldn't flip the switch unless she wants me dead. :D
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Oh...
I'd get the municipality to turn off at the street pole then :D
 
^^That is convenient. Don't think I can at my place... have to call the monkeypality.
 
Swa said:
Nope, I found out I have to hammer away at 3cm of wall and plaster to fit the new DB. Bugger.
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While you are at it with the hammer and chisel and if the new DB allows for it consider providing more conduits upwards towards the ceiling. Never mind, the really painful part of the job is over when you have finished with the chiselling, plastering and painting plus becoming an expert in using a vacuum cleaner.
 
So it was more like 6cm to hammer away and I ended up having to hammer right though the wall to get the old one out as it had some kind of mesh attached to it. Only have plugs and lights right now and one fan/light keeps tripping the E/L.

It was worse than I thought. Only one set of plugs were connected through the E/L.

Geoff.D said:
While you are at it with the hammer and chisel and if the new DB allows for it consider providing more conduits upwards towards the ceiling. Never mind, the really painful part of the job is over when you have finished with the chiselling, plastering and painting plus becoming an expert in using a vacuum cleaner.
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Turns out you were somewhat right about the plugs. One set going to the extended living room is only 1.5mm. I don't what he was thinking, all the others appear to be 4mm. Maybe I'll isolate that one and put in a 15A breaker?
 
Swa said:
So it was more like 6cm to hammer away and I ended up having to hammer right though the wall to get the old one out as it had some kind of mesh attached to it. Only have plugs and lights right now and one fan/light keeps tripping the E/L.

It was worse than I thought. Only one set of plugs were connected through the E/L.


Turns out you were somewhat right about the plugs. One set going to the extended living room is only 1.5mm. I don't what he was thinking, all the others appear to be 4mm. Maybe I'll isolate that one and put in a 15A breaker?
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You're waisting your time. Just rewire the whole house ffs.
 
Swa said:
So it was more like 6cm to hammer away and I ended up having to hammer right though the wall to get the old one out as it had some kind of mesh attached to it. Only have plugs and lights right now and one fan/light keeps tripping the E/L.

It was worse than I thought. Only one set of plugs were connected through the E/L.


Turns out you were somewhat right about the plugs. One set going to the extended living room is only 1.5mm. I don't what he was thinking, all the others appear to be 4mm. Maybe I'll isolate that one and put in a 15A breaker?
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Nice man, sounds like it's been an awesome learning curve.
Always look on the bright side...
That fan / light that's tripping earth - I'd hazard a guess that the issue is on the fan side - if you lift it's covers you'll likely see a loose earth or a short to earth on either the live or neutral side.
 
Swa said:
Turns out you were somewhat right about the plugs. One set going to the extended living room is only 1.5mm. I don't what he was thinking, all the others appear to be 4mm. Maybe I'll isolate that one and put in a 15A breaker?
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Replace the 1.5mm with a 2.5mm wire wile you are busy now. Don't go bigger than 15A on the breakers per plug.
15a = 3.3Kw (min 2.5mm wiring if i'm not mistaken)
10a = 2.2Kw

Remember the wire needs to carry the load for ALL the plugs on the circuit.
 
spiderz said:
Replace the 1.5mm with a 2.5mm wire wile you are busy now. Don't go bigger than 15A on the breakers per plug.
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Plugs with any wire less than 2.5mm is illegal. Also as far as I can tell form the picture his wiring is 4mm.

Plugs in South Africa should be on 20a breakers.

4mm may be required for long runs. This is to remain complaint with the allowed voltage drop for a circuit.

spiderz said:
15a = 3.3Kw (min 2.5mm wiring if i'm not mistaken)
10a = 2.2Kw
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Wire is never sold based on kW ratings. The amount of power is immaterial.
They are sold with a voltage rating (typically 500v for T&E and 1000v for GP) and an amperage rating.
Furthermore the amperage rating differs depending on installation type, eg. roof space, wall, pipe, etc.

Aberdare makes the information publicly available which is the most commonly used complaint wire in SA.

spiderz said:
Remember the wire needs to carry the load for ALL the plugs on the circuit.
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So what, the circuit breaker protects the wire.
 
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Billy said:
I am pretty sure that the 20A figure is the maximum for a socket circuit. It is allowable to have a smaller Circuit Breaker.
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Actually I think you're right, it's 20a max for unprotected socket outlets and definitely 20a max for light circuits. If you have protection at the socket, it can be higher. 20a is a good rule of thumb for max.
 
Sabre Wulf said:
Nice man, sounds like it's been an awesome learning curve.
Always look on the bright side...
That fan / light that's tripping earth - I'd hazard a guess that the issue is on the fan side - if you lift it's covers you'll likely see a loose earth or a short to earth on either the live or neutral side.
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Yeah I guess it could have been worse with a wiring fault but it's only when switching on the fan or light.
 
Swa said:
Yeah I guess it could have been worse with a wiring fault but it's only when switching on the fan or light.
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Ah, so it could also be a short on the switch side then - do you have older metal conduit by chance? Also check that you don't have a metal face plate on the switch with a short.
 
There is much speculation in the thread, so I cracked open my old SANS documents. Latest amendment I have is SANS 10142-1:2012.

6.7.5.5 The following do not need earth leakage protection:
Amdt 3
a) socket-outlets connected to a safety supply, but see 7.8.3.3 and 7.12;
Amdt 5
b) a socket-outlet that complies with SANS 164-4 and that is intended only for the connection of an appliance for critical application (such as emergency lighting, a deep-freeze, a burglar alarm, data processing equipment, or life-supporting equipment); Amdt 5; amdt 8
c) circuits that supply fixed socket-outlets positioned out of normal reach, rated at less than 16 A and intended for the connection of luminaires (see 6.14.1.4); and
d) a stove coupler that complies with SANS 60309-1/IEC 60309-1 and of dimensions as given in SANS 337 (see 6.15.1.2.5). Amdt 5

6.7.5.6 A warning label shall be fitted to every socket-outlet circuit where Amdt 5
a) the rated earth leakage tripping current (rated residual current) IΔn is higher than 30 mA, or Amdt 3; amdt 5
b) the socket-outlet circuit is powered from a safety supply,or
c) the socket-outlet circuit is on dimmer control, indicating such tripping current, safety supply or dimmer control. Amdt5 Amdt 5 Amdt 5

..

6.15.3 Single-phase circuits that only supply socket-outlets rated at 16 A
Single-phase circuits that only supply socket-outlets rated at not more than 16 A,
a) shall have over current protection;
b) shall use conductors that are rated at not less than 16A;
c) shall, if the circuit protection is rated at more than 20 A, use only protected socket-outlets, with, as far as is practicable, discrimination between the protective devices for the circuit and the protective devices associated with the socket-outlets. The protective device of a protected socket-outlet shall
1) have a fixed rated current that does not exceed the rating of the socket-outlet,
2) be mounted next to the socket-outlet that it protects,
3) provide protection against over load currents,
4) provide protection against short-circuit currents, unless short- circuit protection is provided by a separate device, for example on the distribution board,
5) if it needs the protection of a back-up short-circuit device, be marked with the required or maximum rating of the back-up device,
6) if it protects more than one socket-outlet, be so installed that all the socket-outlets are connected in parallel, have the same rated current, and are mounted next to the device, and
7) if it is a circuit-breaker,comply with the requirements of 6.8.2.
NOTE In the interests of safety, the use of the building, the convenience of the occupants and the possibility of heating and cooling equipment being connected to socket-outlets, should be considered when the number and position of points of consumption are being determined.
..
..

6.15.5 Circuits that supply single-phase socket-outlets rated at more than 16 A, or that supply three-phase socket-outlets, or both
In a circuit that supplies single-phase socket-outlets rated at more than 16 A, or that supplies three-phase socket-outlets, or both, and that supplies more than one socket-outlet,
a) single-phase and three-phase socket-outlets may be supplied from the same circuit; and
b) the rating of the circuit protection shall not exceed 125% of the rating of the lowest rated socket-outlet, or each socket-outlet that has a rating of less than that of the circuit protection shall be individually protected against over current.

...

6.16.2 Water heaters
NOTE Water heaters include geysers, instantaneous water heaters including units for boiling water, and the like (see also 6.16.1). Amdt 4
6.16.2.1 All water heaters shall be bonded in accordance with 6.13.
6.16.2.2 Dedicated circuits shall be provided for water heaters and there may be more than one water heater on each circuit.
NOTE If a water heater is installed in a bathroom, see table 7.1 regarding earth leakage protection.
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The document is 400 pages long.
 
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