Setting up solar panels

[ghoti]

Im trying to find the most cost effective route to setup a solar powered system for my house. I am just looking to run a TV, a couple of laptops and a couple of cellphones off the system.

I already have a gas stove and gas fridge (have not worked out a solution for the geyser yet).

Whats the best company to approach for this kind of equipment, and who also has decent pricing.

I am also wondering what the full hardware spec for this type of project would be. So far... solar panels... battery and inverter. Not to sure what else would be required.

Does anyone have any suggestions for this?

[Scooby_Doo]

Should maybe run the lights too, plus you can get solar heated geyser, lol, but you might be able to see your house shining from space with that many solar pannels, sorry just thought would add that donno anyone off hand, where you located?

[ghoti]

Located in the Eastern Cape, have paraffin lights already (come from a farm). Will most likely go for a gas geyser.

[Albereth]

Wizard - you need to work backwards.

How much juice do you need per hour, how many hours do you expect to run independent of Eishcom and what is the peak load you'll need. Those numbers will give you an didication of what needs to come out of the inverter, and hence how many batteries you'll need. I suppose the idea is for your panels to charge the batteries.

[Frankie]

Should maybe run the lights too, plus you can get solar heated geyser, lol, but you might be able to see your house shining from space with that many solar pannels, sorry just thought would add that donno anyone off hand, where you located?

There could be a hidden gain here - the panels will shade the house in summer and hence no need for an AC.

[ghoti]

Wizard - you need to work backwards.

How much juice do you need per hour, how many hours do you expect to run independent of Eishcom and what is the peak load you'll need. Those numbers will give you an didication of what needs to come out of the inverter, and hence how many batteries you'll need. I suppose the idea is for your panels to charge the batteries.

Well, its a 74cm TV. 3 Laptops and 2 cellphones that need to be kept on for at least 3 hours (for now). I assume I can add extra batteries as I go along should I required more capacity?

[BCO]

w1zard, a colleague of mine is about to bring in a container load of panels from China that should be about 40% cheaper than what's available on the market ATM. I'll be getting involved with the distribution of these panels, so if you're interested, gimme a PM.

Looking at your requirements briefly, I'd say you need a 1000W inverter/charger and you'd use about 1.5kWh over 3 hours of usage. You could get away with 2x 102Ah batteries, but this system will discharge them quite deeply over that period. Also, bear in mind that ithe size of your inverter/charger will affect how many batteries you can have connected (it needs to output a certain number of amps per battery). A 1000W inverter/charger can take (iirc) max. 4 batteries.

2 batteries and the inverter will set you back about R5k.

To generate 1500Wh of power a day, you'd need about 500W worth of panels, which at current prices would come to about R15k (current SA prices, not the panels we'll be bringing in).

You then need a solar control module, wiring and installation, so all in your system would cost roughly R25k.

[The_Librarian]

@ wizard - good luck with that, and do let us know once your system is up and running. :)

I'm also looking to go the same route myself - want to put the fridge/freezer on solar power to remove the dependency upon eskom.

[Captain Slog]

2 batteries and the inverter will set you back about R5k.

To generate 1500Wh of power a day, you'd need about 500W worth of panels, which at current prices would come to about R15k (current SA prices, not the panels we'll be bringing in).

You then need a solar control module, wiring and installation, so all in your system would cost roughly R25k.

It would be cheaper to charge the batteries from the Escum supply, when it is on, than solar!

[ghoti]

Those two will suck a lot of power Mr Librarian, not to sure if solar is the best option for that. You should consider gas alternatives. Its a lot cheaper.

[BCO]

BTW, w1z4d, where did you get your gas fridge? I have mains gas at home and want to run a fridge off that.

[The_Librarian]

It would be cheaper to charge the batteries from the Escum supply, when it is on, than solar!

The general idea is to let the batteries charge from the solar panels, and on cloudy days, charge them from eksverystupidanddom power

No doubt prices will come down as the market is flooded with panels and batteries.

Hope the Chinese imports is good quality ;)

@ wizard - wife does not want to go over to gas :( My decision is not made yet, I want to accumulate a lot of information, and weigh the various options against each other before setting my decision into stone.

No good rushing things at this stage now.

[moklet]

It would be cheaper to charge the batteries from the Escum supply, when it is on, than solar!

I guess if you have the solar panels then it should cost notting to charge the batteries

[The_Librarian]

I guess if you have the solar panels then it should cost notting to charge the batteries

You'll have to recover your expenses on the panel and batteries first before the power will be really "Free"... ;)

[Captain Slog]

The general idea is to let the batteries charge from the solar panels, and on cloudy days, charge them from eksverystupidanddom power

No doubt prices will come down as the market is flooded with panels and batteries.

Hope the Chinese imports is good quality ;)

@ wizard - wife does not want to go over to gas :( My decision is not made yet, I want to accumulate a lot of information, and weigh the various options against each other before setting my decision into stone.

No good rushing things at this stage now.

Any solar installation is going to cost a fortune - even with Chinese panels at 40% less it will STILL be OTT.

Just make a big UPS and use Eskom, mine works perfectly and has made no difference to my power bill. Or don't.

BTW we used to install solar panels on un-manned offshore installations in Angola and the panels were constantly being swiped by passing fishermen.

[ghoti]

BTW, w1z4d, where did you get your gas fridge? I have mains gas at home and want to run a fridge off that.

I went to our farm and fetched it :D Its about... 30 years old but still in good nick :)

I have just spoken to my parents, and the answer I got was, "someone at the bottom of Oxford street".. while that doesnt help you or me in the slightest, I can investigate it more for you and find a decent supplier?

[ghoti]

Also... rather importantly... where/ how does one apply for the promised government subsidies? I would really like to get all this information centralized.

[HavocXphere]

Be sure to post lots of pics in the photos section. :)

[The_Librarian]

Also... rather importantly... where/ how does one apply for the promised government subsidies? I would really like to get all this information centralized.

Sneaky buggers adjusted the price so you'll have to buy some expensive stuff before getting a peanut as rebate :(

[BCO]

Also, AFAIK, the govt. subsidies are only for solar water heaters, not PV panels.

[ghoti]

Also, AFAIK, the govt. subsidies are only for solar water heaters, not PV panels.

Cool where can we get those as well and how much is the government subsidising by? :)

[thedoc!]

I have used KG Electric successfully in the past (www.kgelectric.co.za), Uwe is really professional, reasonable and always has good advice.

Good luck with your project...

[BCO]

Cool where can we get those as well and how much is the government subsidising by? :)

I got mine from Solahart. There's a fairly big subsidy. I was part of the pilot programme and I got R6k back.

@ thedoc! I've also received some helpful advice from Uwe, he seems very knowledgeable.

[Syndyre]

Cool where can we get those as well and how much is the government subsidising by? :)

If you look on the Eskom website they give you an estimated total cost, subsidy amount etc.

[icyrus]

How resilient are solar panels. Will the first jhb hailstorm mean replacements?

[Impreza GT]

I got mine from Solahart. There's a fairly big subsidy. I was part of the pilot programme and I got R6k back.

@ thedoc! I've also received some helpful advice from Uwe, he seems very knowledgeable.

Where do I get the info from? Been doing some "shoping" and need all the info I can get....

[jls_n]

Eskom have updated there list of accredited suppliers. Only 1 so far in the Cape.

http://www.eskomdsm.co.za/swh_7_supplier.htm

[mustangsa]

w1zard, a colleague of mine is about to bring in a container load of panels from China that should be about 40% cheaper than what's available on the market ATM. I'll be getting involved with the distribution of these panels, so if you're interested, gimme a PM.

Looking at your requirements briefly, I'd say you need a 1000W inverter/charger and you'd use about 1.5kWh over 3 hours of usage. You could get away with 2x 102Ah batteries, but this system will discharge them quite deeply over that period. Also, bear in mind that ithe size of your inverter/charger will affect how many batteries you can have connected (it needs to output a certain number of amps per battery). A 1000W inverter/charger can take (iirc) max. 4 batteries.

2 batteries and the inverter will set you back about R5k.

To generate 1500Wh of power a day, you'd need about 500W worth of panels, which at current prices would come to about R15k (current SA prices, not the panels we'll be bringing in).

You then need a solar control module, wiring and installation, so all in your system would cost roughly R25k.
I am interested in this solar panels , please send me the info johangsa@yahoo.com

[PCTECH]

I went to our farm and fetched it :D Its about... 30 years old but still in good nick :)

I have just spoken to my parents, and the answer I got was, "someone at the bottom of Oxford street".. while that doesnt help you or me in the slightest, I can investigate it more for you and find a decent supplier?

LOL Probably Elcos but I think they closed a long time ago :D They had a huge shop and sold virtually everything you'd need to set up a house. I used to love wandering around the shop as a kid.

[Ivork]

From a few months ago, but FYI, place around the corner in Cape Town:

Dear Ivor



Thank you for your enquiry.



Unfortunately we do not sell the cells themselves - we manufacture the panels. What I can suggest to you if you would like a more affordable option is to buy what we call “non-standard” panels. These are panels are 30% cheaper than the prime A-grade panels. A “non-standard” is graded that way because it has a visual flaw such as a crack that affects the output of the panel. So a 150Wp panel may only produce 146Wp. These panels are charged at 2.20Euro/w compared to an A-grade panel which is 3.10Euro/w. To give you a better idea of this please see the table below.

http://www.yellow-mini.co.za/pvpanels.pdf

[Nod]

Can look for prices at pricecheck (http://www.pricecheck.co.za/search/?search=gas+fridge) for gas fridges.

[SoftDux-Rudi]

w1zard, a colleague of mine is about to bring in a container load of panels from China that should be about 40% cheaper than what's available on the market ATM. I'll be getting involved with the distribution of these panels, so if you're interested, gimme a PM.


What brand will this be, and who reliable are they? What would a 80KW cost?


It would be cheaper to charge the batteries from the Escum supply, when it is on, than solar!

Not quite, since you'll need more power to generate the power needed. i.e. if you have a 100A battery, and the charger is 10A, it will take 10hours to recharge. If you were to use 50A of that power at the same time, then it will take 20hours - roughly.




Im trying to find the most cost effective route to setup a solar powered system for my house. I am just looking to run a TV, a couple of laptops and a couple of cellphones off the system.


www.planmypower.co.za have some useful samples of solar driven "dwellings", you could use their calculations as a base to what you need :)




Any solar installation is going to cost a fortune - even with Chinese panels at 40% less it will STILL be OTT.


True, for our house we're looking @ about R100K run the whole house on solar. But, with a R2K electricity bill every month, it could repay itself in a few years time :)

[BCO]

@ softdux - I discussed this with W1z4rd in a couple of pm's, but negelected to post in this thread (sorry) so here goes.

After further investigation with the chinese supply company it looks like the panels won't come in much cheaper than is already available in SA, so my colleague decided not to start bringing them in.

[MontyPython]

Hello w1z4rd,

have a look at this:

http://www.c2r.co.za/html/bulbs___down-lights.html

scroll to the bottom of the page.

Have a look at the rest of the website.
keep in mind that LED's are by nature 12V devices,
so even the lights that gets powered by 220V
have a miniature step-down transformer built inside.

The point being that any of the 220V lights can be
manufactured by the company without the transformer,
therefore all the illumination in your house can be done with batteries
charged by solar PV panels and LED lights.

Regards.

[captainwifi]

Im trying to find the most cost effective route to setup a solar powered system for my house. I am just looking to run a TV, a couple of laptops and a couple of cellphones off the system.

I already have a gas stove and gas fridge (have not worked out a solution for the geyser yet).

Whats the best company to approach for this kind of equipment, and who also has decent pricing.

I am also wondering what the full hardware spec for this type of project would be. So far... solar panels... battery and inverter. Not to sure what else would be required.

Does anyone have any suggestions for this?

Try this http://www.treehugger.com/files/2008/01/molten_salt_as.php it uses molten salts to store energy which can be used at night to drive equipment such as a http://www.stirlingengine.com/ecommerce/product.tcl?product_id=84 to power an alternator. Solar panels from a engineering cost perspective simply isn't going to work.

The molten salts are heated using parabolic mirrors http://solarcooking.wikia.com/wiki/Parabolic_reflectors or this brilliant Fresnel lens design at the bottom http://solarcooking.wikia.com/wiki/Fresnel_reflectors

Molten salt looses only 1degree per day, which means the heat can be stored nearly indefinitly. Combined with a [[SterlingEngine]] it can even power a vehicle. Instead of using batteries which converts chemical energy into electrical energy, thermal energy powers a Stirling engine power the vehicle.
The thermal tanks are heated using [[Solar Energy]] via parabolic reflectors and Fresnel lenses. The thermal tanks can be exchanged anywhere on the road because parabolic reflectors can be built anywhere. The reason why this fantastic idea can't be commercialized is because of key patents holding Stirling engine technology hostage as explained by a Stirling engine developer at [[StirlingEngines]]. We will thus rip-off the patent and make these engines ourselves via a [[FrontingCompany]]. One can imagine the reaction of vehicle companies like Toyota to this, they are excluded because of the patents , because they won't be able to afford the licensing terms by the extortionist holding the world hostage.

[ToxicBunny]

Again, simple question wifybabycakes....

Have you tried any of your suggestions yourself or are you just copying and pasting from other sites?

As for ripping off patents... thats illegal, and please stop trying to get other people to break the law, its getting tiresome.

[captainwifi]

As for ripping off patents... thats illegal...

Being awarded a patent doesn't automatically mean the patent is valid. Only the court can decide that. Webber Wentzel and other patent attorneys have conned many people into filing patents, wasting their money because as an individual you don't have the funds to fight Altech in court. Altech says your patent is invalid as they certainly have the right to say. You can't sue Altech, unless you have millions.

Take software patents for example, Amazon have patented one-click shopping which is ridiculous. There is nothing immoral, unethical or "illegal" about putting an icon on you site for people to click. What we have is what Mbalula called "much mockering about". Webber Wentzel is "mockering about with your head", the lawyers are engaging in "mind mokkering".

If it isn't immoral to copy a one-click idea, then why is it immoral to copy a design to power my house at night using molten salts?

[rebel998]

But copying a patent is only illegal if you do it commercially isn't it? Let's say I reproduce a routerbord and use it for personal use, is that still illegal?:D

[captainwifi]

The problem we face in SA is the peak load on the Escom grid around 6pm when everybody switches on their heaters. Think of a container with molten salts lets say 2 x3m as a huge battery. The container is heated up during the day using solar parabolic reflectors. The energy inside gets released via a heat exchanger to provide energy during the night. Solar panels don't solve this problem because they generate electrical energy which can only be stored efficiently into chemical energy(batteries) . Batteries are way to expensive and pollute the environment.

The technical solutions for the urbanite and farmer to remove themselves 95% from Eskoms grid exists just like the technology to provide 100meg over 40km via an RF link on Wimax. What prevents this from being commercialized in a normal manner is patents.
People still think that cancer hasn't been solved, that bandwidth is impossible to obtain or that we must burn through our scarce coal reserves because the technolgy isn'y mature yet. NOthing could be further from the truth, this stuff works as Rocketdyne , Solar one and others have shown. But they have patents. Further more there is transmission and switching losses with long distance transmission. With my idea using thermal energy , the power generation and usage are together. IT is all to do with the cost/performance ratio of the various technology.

The public at large don't understand this fully.

[captainwifi]

But copying a patent is only illegal if you do it commercially isn't it? Let's say I reproduce a routerbord and use it for personal use, is that still illegal?:D

True, what you do in your backyard is your business, it only becomes an issue if you commercialize it. you can be sued, or at least your fronting company or empowerment partner. The main crises for altech and other is that as the public figures out that we will never get cheap energy because Altech simply can't help us with it, we will do it ourselves which leaves them doing what?

[ToxicBunny]

100meg over 40km via an RF link on Wimax..

Interesting, I thought Wimax's max throughput was 70meg... so they've revised the technology then?

and do you even BEGIN to realise how expensive it is to remove your reliance on eskom for electricity wifybabycakes... NONE of the solutions are economically viable on a small scale.

The public may not understand that its possible.. but thats irrelevant, at the moment its not economically viable to do so.

WTF does Altech have to do with energy?... Eskom yes, but Altech? or is this more of your Naspers conspiracy tripe?

[rebel998]

Cheap, clean sustainable energy should not be given a patent!:D

[antowan]

But copying a patent is only illegal if you do it commercially isn't it? Let's say I reproduce a routerbord and use it for personal use, is that still illegal?:D

I cannot see how it can be. As long as you did it for yourself. If you can do it though, why not license the technique and go into business. :)

[antowan]

I see folks are getting personal on topics that can either be ignored or perhaps replied to with a counter argument. I have removed the posts in question and their responses. Keep it fair and clean folks. :)

[cbrunsdonza]

Our new office has gone green and we have storage batteries (a stack of them), high end regulators and solar panels.

What we learn't about solar panels is your grid is only as good as your weakest panel !!!

So if one panel is only producing 30% then your entire grid drops to 30%, makes no sense but that is just how it works. Thats why these things are so friggin expensive for home/office use as they all have to be of the same quality/grade.

We also have 2 DC air-conditioners that can run up to 4 hours on their batteries - friggin awesome stuff :)


BTW: We had ours installed by a german fella who did the Cape Town German School according to German Government standards - my boet-in-law works for Eskom (top senior engineer) and told me how green-energy advanced the Germans are.

[ToxicBunny]

Its awesome to see companies doing that.... big up to your company cbrunsdonza....

I would love to be able to do it at home, just keep looking at the sums and seeing how expensive it is and how it would cost me more in the long run...

[metalcore]

Our new office has gone green and we have storage batteries (a stack of them), high end regulators and solar panels.

What we learn't about solar panels is your grid is only as good as your weakest panel !!!

So if one panel is only producing 30% then your entire grid drops to 30%, makes no sense but that is just how it works. Thats why these things are so friggin expensive for home/office use as they all have to be of the same quality/grade.

We also have 2 DC air-conditioners that can run up to 4 hours on their batteries - friggin awesome stuff :)


BTW: We had ours installed by a german fella who did the Cape Town German School according to German Government standards - my boet-in-law works for Eskom (top senior engineer) and told me how green-energy advanced the Germans are.

The germans are really ahead of the pack. They have an incentive where the government buys back power you generate from solar at a higher rate than whats it sold for if I am not mistaken. This is fixed for the next 10 years. This has resulted in it actually becoming economically benefitial for the public to actually instal panels. Farmers are now using their land to farm sun and sell the power to the grid.

[cbrunsdonza]

The germans are really ahead of the pack. They have an incentive where the government buys back power you generate from solar at a higher rate than whats it sold for if I am not mistaken. This is fixed for the next 10 years. This has resulted in it actually becoming economically benefitial for the public to actually instal panels. Farmers are now using their land to farm sun and sell the power to the grid.

Yup. We are actually investing alot of cash to do the same here at our office once regulations allow it. Its also just cool to live in a green office, especially when Eskom goes down and we still have power and aircons.

[rebel998]

Farmers are now using their land to farm sun and sell the power to the grid.

Geez that could work here couldn't it?

We have lots of sun and with all the drought it seems Watts might be a good economical investment as a crop?:D

[captainwifi]

Those of you with water and large area such as farms should consider using a Turbine to generate power.

http://quasiturbine.promci.qc.ca/ Has nice picture as well
This is the patent http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6899075.html

actually it is this patent: http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/pdfs/patent_id/6164263.html from http://www.gizmag.com/go/3501/picture/7183/
The quasiturbine patent expires 2023, commercially they are not available , only single units for around $9000. Thus we will hack the patent. Any component can be scanned with a 3d laser scanner to get the design on auto-cad.

If the parabolic is large the construction costs go up. Smaller units allow heating smaller Stirling engines, which each creates small current that can be added. What seems to be most efficient are parabolic troughs that heats a pipe running its length to generate steam and the steam turns the turbine. Huge amounts of watts can be generated like this because the sun focuses 1kwatt per square meter.

http://www.pritchardpower.com.au/technology.aspx
The patented boiler does not use any form of 'pressure' cylinder but rather is a 'flash' boiler. We call it a 'steam generator'. If the mechanical power of the engine is not needed, the small and highly efficient steam generator can be used directly to produce either wet or dry steam, and thus deliver sterilizing, distillation, process heat, hot water and space heating depending on how the steam/water circuit is configured.

The patented engine of the S5000 has done for steam engines what IBM did for the computer, made it (PC) personal. The Pritchard Power stationary engine has the potential to deliver a system that could comfortably power and heat an average suburban home, providing hot water, electricity and space heating, all from pelletised wood fuels. This is referred to as CHP, or combined heat and power.

Using high quality pelletised fuels a Pritchard CHP system should produce no visible smoke, be able to be largely automatically controlled like other modern home heating system. A program of work is also underway to develop a system that would run off natural gas for those applications where use of renewable solid fuels was not practical and where gas is available.

Dont reinvent the wheel
Look at how India deals with the problem: http://www.tinytechindia.com/steampowerplan.htm

[Arthur]

Just an aside. According to various suppliers and knowledgeable insiders I've spoken to, panel prices are at record lows owing to a glut. Now's the time to buy, if you're planning PV.

[MontyPython]

http://www.fin24.com/articles/default/display_article.aspx?Channel=News_Home&ArticleId=1518-24_2540292&IsColumnistStory=False

Welcome one and all to 8 or so more years of 30% increases while eskom builds the next power station!!!! Give it a month and the solar PV panels will go up in price.

www.c2r.co.za

[MontyPython]

hooooooooooooooooooo boy people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*** en betaal is die wet van transvaal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.businessday.co.za/articles/Content.aspx?id=79333

if i understand the first para correctly, WE ARE GOING TO GET ESKOM OUT OF THE RED!!!!!!!

how about cutting down your electricity account by changing your lights to LED lights,
and in the process giving eskom less money per month?

LED lights SAVE MORE ENERGY than "energy saving" bulbs.

http://www.c2r.co.za/html/comparative_table.html

[MontyPython]

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&click_id=124&art_id=vn20090910035750440C699852#comment_bottom_b ox

[Arthur]

Switching tracks a little ... since the topic is "Setting up solar panels" ... I'm recabling the house and want to make provision for PV panels to be placed on large flat roof on 2nd floor at some future date. The 12kVA MLT Drives Power Star (with integrated solar regulator) is in the Facilities Room some 15m away. What size conduiting and cabling should I put between the roof/PV panels and the Facilities Room? I forseesee the equivalent of about 10 x 240W panels.

[DeSLAM]

hooooooooooooooooooo boy people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*** en betaal is die wet van transvaal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.businessday.co.za/articles/Content.aspx?id=79333

if i understand the first para correctly, WE ARE GOING TO GET ESKOM OUT OF THE RED!!!!!!!

how about cutting down your electricity account by changing your lights to LED lights,
and in the process giving eskom less money per month?

LED lights SAVE MORE ENERGY than "energy saving" bulbs.

http://www.c2r.co.za/html/comparative_table.html

Make sure BEFORE you buy ...

1. How much heat they give off
2. How bright the light is they emit
3. How COSTLY they are to buy
4. What their life span is

The energy saving lights available in SA as an example.

The don't give off as much light as the advertise, they get dimmer as time goes by.

And I can almost guarantee you that if you keep your receipts for the energy saving lights they will blow/die before their warranty is over....

Now try to get is replaced under warranty.

Think carefully before you leap. The same goes for solar water heating and solar panels.

PS: The NEW slim SA designed solar panels will be manufactured in Paarl soon.

There's a chap who's been building solar water heating tanks in Mosselbay for ages - long before all the hype of solar hit SA. The system is inexpensive...costs way less that the R15000 units sold elsewhere.

[BCO]

Switching tracks a little ... since the topic is "Setting up solar panels" ... I'm recabling the house and want to make provision for PV panels to be placed on large flat roof on 2nd floor at some future date. The 12kVA MLT Drives Power Star (with integrated solar regulator) is in the Facilities Room some 15m away. What size conduiting and cabling should I put between the roof/PV panels and the Facilities Room? I forseesee the equivalent of about 10 x 240W panels.

What voltage are the panels, and will you be connecting the two panels in series or parallel?

[Arthur]

What voltage are the panels, and will you be connecting the two panels in series or parallel?
BCO, I envisage about 10 (not two) panels, and have no idea whether to go in series or parallel - the panels have not been bought, but I need to make provision for the conduiting and cabling so connection to the MLT Power Star (http://www.mltdrives.com/bi-directional-inverters.htm) (12kW system) in future is easy. The DC side of the Power Star is 48V.

[BCO]

BCO, I envisage about 10 (not two) panels, and have no idea whether to go in series or parallel - the panels have not been bought, but I need to make provision for the conduiting and cabling so connection to the MLT Power Star (http://www.mltdrives.com/bi-directional-inverters.htm) (12kW system) in future is easy. The DC side of the Power Star is 48V.

Ah ok, 10 panels - I misread there. So the input side of the inverter (very nice inverter, with built in regulator/charger, BTW) is 48V, meaning you'd need some combination of series/parallel with your panels to get a 48V input to the regulator. So 15m at 48V and a 2400W array equals around 50 amps of current in your wiring. You'd need 13mm2 wiring.

http://www.freesunpower.com/wire_calc.php

http://www.technick.net/public/code/cp_dpage.php?aiocp_dp=guide_awg_to_metric

[MontyPython]

Make sure BEFORE you buy ...

1. How much heat they give off
2. How bright the light is they emit
3. How COSTLY they are to buy
4. What their life span is

The energy saving lights available in SA as an example.

The don't give off as much light as the advertise, they get dimmer as time goes by.

And I can almost guarantee you that if you keep your receipts for the energy saving lights they will blow/die before their warranty is over....

Now try to get is replaced under warranty.

Think carefully before you leap. The same goes for solar water heating and solar panels.

PS: The NEW slim SA designed solar panels will be manufactured in Paarl soon.

There's a chap who's been building solar water heating tanks in Mosselbay for ages - long before all the hype of solar hit SA. The system is inexpensive...costs way less that the R15000 units sold elsewhere.

Let me quote from the opening page of the website:"C2R also has available a 6W down-lighter lamp (12v or 220v) that produces the same light as the traditional 50W halogen down-lighter while having a longer life span. This specific bulb comes as standard with a 2-year warranty, the first year of which is unconditional against manufacturing defects. The second and third years are on a “return-and-repair” basis."

The website has been re-designed and updated with a lot more products. 130+ bulbs, 190+ downlights, 30+ street lights,
70+ wall lights, to mention a few.

Please don't mistake LED lights for CFL(compact fluorescent) or "energy saver" lights. The 2 are worlds apart. LED's last minimum 40 000 hours, don't flicker, contains no mercury, gives off little heat.

[MarkI]

Ah ok, 10 panels - I misread there. So the input side of the inverter (very nice inverter, with built in regulator/charger, BTW) is 48V, meaning you'd need some combination of series/parallel with your panels to get a 48V input to the regulator. So 15m at 48V and a 2400W array equals around 50 amps of current in your wiring. You'd need 13mm2 wiring.

http://www.freesunpower.com/wire_calc.php

http://www.technick.net/public/code/cp_dpage.php?aiocp_dp=guide_awg_to_metric


A basic rule of thumb you can use for DC cabling up to 20m lengths is:
Maximum 4A per 1mm² cable.

I would wire each series string seperately and bring them all together in a combiner box. Before combining each of the strings in parallel put a fuse on each of them so that you can isolate each of the strings seperately for maintenance.
This has a number of advantages:
1. You can do maintenace on each series string seperately and still use the other strings for generating electricity.
2. You only need a very short piece of (13mm2) expensive cabling from the combiner box to the charge controller.
3. Depending on the current generated by each series string, you should only need 4mm2 to 6mm2 cable.

There is however one disadvatage to this setup. You need more cable to connect all your series string to a combiner box.

[wm0000]

Switching tracks a little ... since the topic is "Setting up solar panels" ... I'm recabling the house and want to make provision for PV panels to be placed on large flat roof on 2nd floor at some future date. The 12kVA MLT Drives Power Star (with integrated solar regulator) is in the Facilities Room some 15m away. What size conduiting and cabling should I put between the roof/PV panels and the Facilities Room? I forseesee the equivalent of about 10 x 240W panels.

That's pretty close the the system I just installed. To get the current down, I used a Sunny Boy grid-tied inverter with a 400VDC max input so I wired all my panels in series with standard 7/20 house wire in plastic conduit - panel peak current is about 10A @ around 300VDC. Avoiding shading with series panels is very important but the space used is not obstructed by trees or shadows so it's perfect. I generate about 15KWh / day even with this rain we've had in Gauteng which is pretty good. I'm hoping for about 500KWh / month once the sun shines :)