My Rights: Who Takes the Loss due to Electricity

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Charlie.

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Let's say that I have an appointment with a professional who bills for his time and requires electricity to do his job. Five minutes into the appointment, the power is cut. Who takes the loss?

Do I pay the professional for the appointment, even though I never received the service he was selling?

Does he take the hit, laughing it off as "tough luck"?

What are my rights?

(BTW: We need a "Constitutional / Legal Rights" forum somewhere under General discussions.)
 
I would not pay for services not rendered.

What if you go to your appointment and the consultant gets a urgent call and leaves? Would you pay for that?

I wouldn't.
 
Those two situations are not comparable. One is caused by Eskom, a third party, while the other is the consultant's own decision to leave. He could ignore the call. Presumably, he is leaving because the other caller is more important in some way, possibly financially.
 
Charlie. said:
Those two situations are not comparable. One is caused by Eskom, a third party, while the other is the consultant's own decision to leave. He could ignore the call. Presumably, he is leaving because the other caller is more important in some way, possibly financially.
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True, in your instance the consultant availed his time (already including travelling expenses) and regardless whether you were able to fully use the hour or not it is your obligation to pay the consultant.

A case of: don't make your problem the consultants problem. That being said, Eskom should be the ones refunding EVERYONE!
 
As a consultant I would want to be paid. If there was disagreement on this I would strike a deal for half hour pay to cover costs af arriving at the meeting, etc.

I lost a bunch of cash last week due to power failure and not being able to complete my work with a client. But I was at home, so can't bill them based on power outage... :(
 
vespax said:
As a consultant I would want to be paid. If there was disagreement on this I would strike a deal for half hour pay to cover costs af arriving at the meeting, etc.

I lost a bunch of cash last week due to power failure and not being able to complete my work with a client. But I was at home, so can't bill them based on power outage... :(
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Yeah, unfortunately you can't do anything about that.
 
Travelling expenses - ok. I can accept that.

What happens when I go and visit the consultant and we both end up at his offices, without any electricity? He has done nothing.

Example: doctor. You make an appointment for 14h00. Arrive at 14h00 and wait until 14h29. As you walk into his surgery, the power is cut (14h30). He says you must come back tomorrow. Do you pay for that appointment?
 
I wouldn't pay him a cent, let's say he is a installer of some kind that requires power tools, I expect him to bring the tools to complete the job, if said job requires power then he'd best get a power generator. I never made the agreement that there would be power, he simply assumed there would be power and hoped for the best, his loss.

You don't pitch up at a car garage and they expect you to provide the equipment to repair your car, that's part of the services fee.
 
Charlie. said:
Let's say that I have an appointment with a professional who bills for his time and requires electricity to do his job. Five minutes into the appointment, the power is cut. Who takes the loss?
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Let's be clear here. 5 minutes in and the power goes out. Do you just throw your arms up and say " oh well, guess we can't work!" No, you make due, you talk about things that don't require electricity, etc. I have been to appointments with clients, they forgot something that was needed, but we still carried on and made due. Not ideal, but it gets done in the end. In fact on did that on Friday afternoon with a client.

A consultant has to be resourceful. Get things done, even if it is inconvenient at times.
 
I'm a computer technician. I cannot work without power. I don't have a generator I can schlep around with me either! If I'm called out and the power goes off while I'm working - you are liable for my account up until the time the power goes off. That would be my call out (R228 VAT inclusive) which will also include 15 mins of my time and travelling costs if you live more than 30km from the workshop. After 15 mins you pay labour at R228/hour or part thereof. That is not to say I won't charge in 15 minute intervals but a lot depends on the customers attitude.

If you call me out and while I'm on my way the power goes out AND YOU DON'T BOTHER TO NOTIFY ME you will be liable for the callout, not negotiable and I explain this to all my new customers. Those who are foolish enough to test me on this have become ex-customers and some have even ended up having to deal with my lawyer.
 
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A dentist got sued for being unable to finish a root canal because of a power outage. Had to pay R60k in damages (and pain). The dentist can try to recoup his money from the municipality.
 
PCTECH said:
I'm a computer technician. I cannot work without power. I don't have a generator I can schlep around with me either! If I'm called out and the power goes off while I'm working - you are liable for my account up until the time the power goes off. That would be my call out (R228 VAT inclusive) which will also include 15 mins of my time and travelling costs if you live more than 30km from the workshop. After 15 mins you pay labour at R228/hour or part thereof. That is not to say I won't charge in 15 minute intervals but a lot depends on the customers attitude.

If you call me out and while I'm on my way the power goes out AND YOU DON'T BOTHER TO NOTIFY ME you will be liable for the callout, not negotiable and I explain this to all my new customers. Those who are foolish enough to test me on this have become ex-customers and some have even ended up having to deal with my lawyer.
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Fair enough.
 
I'll have to charge you for the "material" that was used during that time...ie Dentist --> anaesthetic...Labour --> none
 
Only if you can proof beyond reasonable doubt that Eskom was negligent.
Matthews Bantsijang
 
I'm there to fix your pc (or any other electrical appliance) - it is for you to supply the power. No power for whatever reason - eskom failure, cables stolen, you didn't pay your bill - i don't care, that's between yourself and your service provider - not between ME and YOUR service provider - YOU PAY, and claim damages from them.
 
If you go to the consultants premises and for reasons beyond your control the consultant is unable to deliver the service at his premises then he cannot charge.
It would be reasonable to negotiate a payment based on the time and portion of the services he rendered up until the time the power went off.

It may be a little different if it were at your premises, but I'd still expect the consultant not to charge the full fee - after all, he would still like further business with you.
 
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Charlie. said:
Travelling expenses - ok. I can accept that.

What happens when I go and visit the consultant and we both end up at his offices, without any electricity? He has done nothing.

Example: doctor. You make an appointment for 14h00. Arrive at 14h00 and wait until 14h29. As you walk into his surgery, the power is cut (14h30). He says you must come back tomorrow. Do you pay for that appointment?
Click to expand...

Charlie, is this an hypothetical or based on some experience? One can go on forever with what ifs. For instance:

what happens if the consultant does 90% of the work and then drops dead? Would you pay his estate for the work done?
why didn't YOU install an UPS in order to protect the consultant from wasting his time in the event of a power failure?
​

It all depends on your relationship with the consultant.

But yes, you will have to pay, unless the consultant guaranteed that the problem would be fixed before he left.
 
Case of severe thread grave-digging? :p
Eskom's contract is only to supply power to the municipality and a clause in the contract says they cannot be sued for services not rendered. Well the municipalities signed those contracts so there's nothing that can be done. You can only try and claim back from your municipality in that case.
 
Charlie. said:
Travelling expenses - ok. I can accept that.

What happens when I go and visit the consultant and we both end up at his offices, without any electricity? He has done nothing.

Example: doctor. You make an appointment for 14h00. Arrive at 14h00 and wait until 14h29. As you walk into his surgery, the power is cut (14h30). He says you must come back tomorrow. Do you pay for that appointment?
Click to expand...

Actually you invoice the doctor for the 30 minutes of your time he wasted by not adhering to the agreement he made with you.

I've twice invoiced doctors for making me wait an unreasonable amount of time and both times they paid.
 
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