O/T digression from "Has switching off your geyser saved you money?"

A

Albereth

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LancelotSA said:
That's fine! But then accept load shedding as a way of life.

Like kids, if you can't sort things out yourself then Dad (Eskom) will step in and sort it out for you.

It's that whole spoilt entitlement attitude again.
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Except what we have here are two kids fighting over who gets to ride the bike and dad is the one who only bought one bike even though he knew he was having twins. And he's let the tyres down too.
 
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Albereth said:
Except what we have here are two kids fighting over who gets to ride the bike and dad is the one who only bought one bike even though he knew he was having twins. And he's let the tyres down too.
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...and if you would like to take that analogy even further you could say the kids should be thankful that they have one bike to share.... we all know there are other kids out there who will never own a bike!!
 
LancelotSA said:
...and if you would like to take that analogy even further you could say the kids should be thankful that they have one bike to share.... we all know there are other kids out there who will never own a bike!!
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More like the kids used their own pocket money to buy the bike in the first place - the drunk dad then flogged it to a neighbour to buy some more beer.
LancelotSA said:
...and you forget what I reckon must be king.... HEATERS!! Bear in mind that these usually run for hours as opposed to minutes for the others. And the crazy thing is that warm clothes and blankets could negate the need for these...

...but I do not doubt for one second that the whole entitlement argument will rear it's head here again. "If I want the luxury of a heater I should be allowed blah blah...."
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Heat should not be considered a luxury simply because of ineptitude. ;)
 
bwana said:
More like the kids used their own pocket money to buy the bike in the first place - the drunk dad then flogged it to a neighbour to buy some more beer.Heat should not be considered a luxury simply because of ineptitude. ;)
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We seldom seem to agree.

I am with you on this one though !:D
 
bwana said:
More like the kids used their own pocket money to buy the bike in the first place - the drunk dad then flogged it to a neighbour to buy some more beer.Heat should not be considered a luxury simply because of ineptitude. ;)
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Heat is a luxury to some. Further to this heat is attainable without the need for heaters, central heating etc... those are luxuries no matter how you look at it. Give a blanket to a homeless person during winter and see how thankful they would be. And you know what, as a bonus a blanket uses no electricity.

The arguments always seem to revolve around "us" (the consumer) not having to suffer as a result of "them" (government) not forseeing these power problems. Well bottom line is we now have these problems so we all need to see how we can assist in resolving it. This is after all our country. They are after all our government. Like it or not. Or is that where the problem lies... you do not feel it is your government? Well then we do have issues!
 
LancelotSA said:
Heat is a luxury to some. Further to this heat is attainable without the need for heaters, central heating etc... those are luxuries no matter how you look at it. Give a blanket to a homeless person during winter and see how thankful they would be. And you know what, as a bonus a blanket uses no electricity.

The arguments always seem to revolve around "us" (the consumer) not having to suffer as a result of "them" (government) not forseeing these power problems. Well bottom line is we now have these problems so we all need to see how we can assist in resolving it. This is after all our country. They are after all our government. Like it or not. Or is that where the problem lies... you do not feel it is your government? Well then we do have issues!
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Fortunately there is a thing called progress.

My grandfather's father used candles. They also did not have electicity.

They used blankets in winter.

After two centuries of progress ,you expect us to be glad to go back to primitive times?

There is a joke going around:What did we use before candles?





Electricity!
 
Piepalook said:
Fortunately there is a thing called progress.

My grandfather's father used candles. They also did not have electicity.

They used blankets in winter.

After two centuries of progress ,you expect us to be glad to go back to primitive times?

There is a joke going around:What did we use before candles? Electricity![
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First off, your family either live to a ripe age or you have your kids real late in life...

Secondly, that was your grandfather's father...

Your grandfather had electricity but never experienced economic growth of over 5% per annum. Your grandfather also lived in a time when less than 5% of the population had access to electricity.

Besides, even if we had ample electricity, in this day and age we should be advanced enough after "two centuries of progress" to realise that electricity is not an endless resource to be squandered wherever possible. Soon enough it will be your great grandchildren sitting on here chatting about how their grandfather's father squandered limited resources due to his reluctance to give up some of his luxuries.
 
LancelotSA said:
First off, your family either live to a ripe age or you have your kids real late in life...

Secondly, that was your grandfather's father...

Your grandfather had electricity but never experienced economic growth of over 5% per annum. Your grandfather also lived in a time when less than 5% of the population had access to electricity.

Besides, even if we had ample electricity, in this day and age we should be advanced enough after "two centuries of progress" to realise that electricity is not an endless resource to be squandered wherever possible. Soon enough it will be your great grandchildren sitting on here chatting about how their grandfather's father squandered limited resources due to his reluctance to give up some of his luxuries.
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IMHO the jury is still out on the economic growth bit.

I know we had 5% economic growth,during wich time no money was spent on infrastructure.
Unfortunately it caught up with us.
Should you offset the cost of repairing infrastructure against the 5% growth, you will notice that we did not have a positive growth but rather a negative growth.
This negative growth will be with us for the forseeable future.

Sorry to burst your bubble.
 
[-]//Completely off topic[/-]
LancelotSA said:
Heat is a luxury to some.
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Whose fault is that that people cant afford what you say is the cheapest electricity in the world?
LancelotSA said:
Give a blanket to a homeless person during winter and see how thankful they would be. And you know what, as a bonus a blanket uses no electricity.
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Get him a job, food and a house with electricity and he'll be even happier.
LancelotSA said:
This is after all our country. They are after all our government. Like it or not. Or is that where the problem lies... you do not feel it is your government? Well then we do have issues!
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They're your government no matter how happy they are to spend my tax money so I guess we do have issues. ;)

Government isnt supposed to be caught off guard by economic growth.
 
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bwana said:
//Completely off topicWhose fault is that that people cant afford what you say is the cheapest electricity in the world?Get him a job, food and a house with electricity and he'll be even happier.They're your government no matter how happy they are to spend my tax money so I guess we do have issues. ;)

Government isnt supposed to be caught off guard by economic growth.
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Also completely Off topic.
I am really starting to like you!

We should double the expenditure on education now.
Education should be free.

Children should not be able to leave school at 16.

Within 20 years we can turn this country around.
The Koreans did it with education. If they could do it , so can we.
 
Piepalook said:
IMHO the jury is still out on the economic growth bit.

I know we had 5% economic growth,during wich time no money was spent on infrastructure.
Unfortunately it caught up with us.
Should you offset the cost of repairing infrastructure against the 5% growth, you will notice that we did not have a positive growth but rather a negative growth.
This negative growth will be with us for the forseeable future.

Sorry to burst your bubble.
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Nope not true, the measure of your GDP growth does not consider where the money is spent.

Don't ignore the global impact on our economy as well.
 
Piepalook said:
Also completely Off topic.
I am really starting to like you!

We should double the expenditure on education now.
Education should be free.

Children should not be able to leave school at 16.

Within 20 years we can turn this country around.
The Koreans did it with education. If they could do it , so can we.
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While I agree in principle, how do you expect the country to pay for this?
 
fivelza said:
While I agree in principle, how do you expect the country to pay for this?
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By stopping immediately with the arms deal.

We cannot afford it.

We do not need it.

We have no enemies at this stage.

I suggest making all, including university education free.

Those that are not university material, but want to study should be apprenticed,with pay subsidised by government.

This is the only way that we can turn this country around.

We can do this with education.

In 20 years most of our problems including the racial issue would have dissapeared.
 
Maybe the following sounds outlandish, but...

Not only should education be free, basic food as well! Shucks, there is enough food available to feed all the people, so there shouldn't be starving people in the country! (Actually, in the world!) But the sad thing is that the owners (read: corporates) would rather destroy unsold food than give it away to starving people! :sick:
 
Piepalook said:
By stopping immediately with the arms deal.

We cannot afford it.

We do not need it.

We have no enemies at this stage.

I suggest making all, including university education free.

Those that are not university material, but want to study should be apprenticed,with pay subsidised by government.

This is the only way that we can turn this country around.

We can do this with education.

In 20 years most of our problems including the racial issue would have dissapeared.
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"At this stage"... and guess who will be the first to be making the most noise if we all of a sudden do develop an enemy? All of a sudden we will have certain people b_tching that the government should have foreseen this and bought arms....

But we all know they can never win...
 
ettubrute said:
Maybe the following sounds outlandish, but...

Not only should education be free, basic food as well! Shucks, there is enough food available to feed all the people, so there shouldn't be starving people in the country! (Actually, in the world!) But the sad thing is that the owners (read: corporates) would rather destroy unsold food than give it away to starving people! :sick:
Click to expand...

Hey wait a minute I think I have heard a theory like this before.... ummm.... what would it be now.... oh yeah SOCIALISM!!!!
 
LancelotSA said:
Hey wait a minute I think I have heard a theory like this before.... ummm.... what would it be now.... oh yeah SOCIALISM!!!!
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Well, that's maybe what you call it. I call it humanism! Don't you think it's just humane to feed hungry people, especially when there is enough food in the world to do it?
 
ettubrute said:
Well, that's maybe what you call it. I call it humanism! Don't you think it's just humane to feed hungry people, especially when there is enough food in the world to do it?
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Well, actually, me and pretty much the rest of the world!

The problem is a little deeper than merely feeding hungry people.... do you also bathe them... clothe them... house them... medicate them... care for them.... and all this while they do not work? So what of those that do work? Do they get all this stuff for free too? And if they do then why do they choose to work when they would get the same benefits if they were unemployed?
 
LancelotSA said:
The problem is a little deeper than merely feeding hungry people.... do you also bathe them... clothe them... house them... medicate them... care for them.... and all this while they do not work?
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Why not? There's enough to go around anyway! :cool: (Check for instance this)
LancelotSA said:
So what of those that do work? Do they get all this stuff for free too?
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That would be the only fair option, now wouldn't it? ;)
LancelotSA said:
And if they do then why do they choose to work when they would get the same benefits if they were unemployed?
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Since they are fed, clothed, housed, bathed etc for free, then they would have money to spend on luxuries! Only basic stuff is free, which allows you to exist, but not really to live! Thus, the incentive for working...

Sure enough, lazy asses will do nothing, and have enough to not die, but that happens now as well: beggars, bums, etc... Others will very soon get bored of doing nothing, as well as having only just enough, and will start to work to get the little extras that changes existing into living...

It's worth a try, isn't it? And better than hearing about the billions made in profits by the corporations, which go to enrich the already stinking rich anyways!
 
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