Which display card to buy? - ATI vs nVidia

[smokalot]

Hi everyone,

I am building a new PC from scratch and need some advice on which graphics card to choose. I would like to keep to a certain range of money to spend on this card so I have a few options there.

Firstly do I go ATI or nVidia? I not a HUGE gamer but when I play I want to be able to run the latest games fairly well. Also I do not want to have to deal with any display issues with regards to other apps I might be running. (Which would be mostly web server stuff so it should be cool). Definitely want no O/S issues (probably Windows XP with a partition containing the latest Mandrake Linux).

Here are my choices:

From cheapest to most expensive (in my range)

Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9550 128MB 64Bit
Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6200, 128MB 64Bit
Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9550 128MB 128Bit
Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9550 256MB 128Bit
Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9600 Pro 128MB 128Bit
Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6200, 128MB 128Bit

These are all AGP

Not even considering the PCI Express stuff (personally avoiding those). Obviously it would be ideal to pick the more expensive one but do I need it? So I guess it comes down to ATI vs. nVidia again. :confused:

[Chris]

Well, none of those cards are going to run the games "fairly well". The ( I think) minimum requirement to run games well is a Geforce 6600GT (+-R2000)

[smokalot]

Well, none of those cards are going to run the games "fairly well". The ( I think) minimum requirement to run games well is a Geforce 6600GT (+-R2000)

Are you serious? Sorry I work in IT but am seriously out of touch with the gaming side of things :eek:
Thamks for the reply

[stoke]

Dude - you MAY NOT SKIP PCIe, it's absolutely fantastic, throughput like you've never seen.
And - minimum Graphics card is a NVidea 6600GT.

Well - my opinion.

[rburley]

get the Sapphire 9600XT 256Mb, i have it, even with battlefield 2 (not out yet) it still runs very well. It is geting old now so the price should be quite low but it is still ok for games.

I run doom 3, halflife 2 at full graphics and it runs smooth

[bb_matt]

NAtivida !

Atidia !

[stoke]

get the Sapphire 9600XT 256Mb, i have it, even with battlefield 2 (not out yet) it still runs very well. It is geting old now so the price should be quite low but it is still ok for games.

I run doom 3, halflife 2 at full graphics and it runs smooth

Is that Sapphire 9600XT 256Mb running on a 256 memory bus ?

If so, then it could explain why it's still operating so well.

I then refine my answer to say, if it's running a 128 bit bus, 6600GT is the minimum, if it's running a 256 bit bus, then the 9600XT is ample, and you should decide on the bitwidth first before choosing a card.

The wider the bus, the faster the card no matter what.

[FireFLi]

I have seen 6600GT at +-R1500. For AGP version. :D

[Vio]

Install a PS3 or Xbox 360 :)

[rburley]

Is that Sapphire 9600XT 256Mb running on a 256 memory bus ?

If so, then it could explain why it's still operating so well.

I then refine my answer to say, if it's running a 128 bit bus, 6600GT is the minimum, if it's running a 256 bit bus, then the 9600XT is ample, and you should decide on the bitwidth first before choosing a card.

The wider the bus, the faster the card no matter what.

im not sure, how do i check?

[gkm]

Have a look at this article:
http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041222/index.html

If you are buying a new motherboard and video card, the do not consider AGP if at all possible. PCI Express is the way to go.

[EchoZA]

ASUS 6800LE's are o.k. took me almost a year of fighting to get them to replace my faulty ASUS 9950 but in the end they did! and I'm happy, so far ;) WOW runs fine and that's all I'm worried about at the moment!

[TMoose]

I agree with everybody that said get a PCI-E motherboard and card. AGP is dead. Besides, there's a whole lot of other new technology on the new boards like S-ATA, DDR2 support and processor sockets that'll support dual-core CPU's to consider as well... so in my opinion buying a new board is worth it.

[gkm]

You can check memory bus for other cards like the 9600XT here:
http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041004/vga_charts-02.html

The 9600XT is 128 bit.

[biltonguy]

The best value for money is the 6600GT for about R2k, it keeps up pretty well with the top cards which cost 2-3 times more.

The next card up is the 6800GT IMO which is close to R4k (in SA anyway :( )
and def go pci-e :D

[MaD]

NVIDIA

R 395 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForceFX 5200, 128MB 64Bit, D-SUB + DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor
R 595 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6200, 128MB 64Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor,
R 795 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6200, 128MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor, TurboForce
R 995 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6600, 128MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor, TurboForce
R 1,295 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6600, 256MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor, TurboForce
R 1,595 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6600GT, 128MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor
R 1,795 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6600GT, 128MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ VIVO, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor, TurboForce
R 1,995 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6800, 128MB 256Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor
R 2,950 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6800GT, 256MB 256Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor
R 3,950 Gigabyte® nVidia® GeForce 6800 Ultra, 256MB 256Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, nView Multi-Monitor


ATI
R 295 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9250 128MB 64Bit, D-SUB+ TV-OUT, DirectX 8.1 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView (1x Monitor & 1x TV)
R 495 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9250 128MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ VIVO, DirectX 8.1 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView
R 395 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9550 128MB 64Bit, D-SUB+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView (1x Monitor & 1x TV)
R 495 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9550 128MB 64Bit, DVI (+ Converter)+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView (1x Monitor & 1x TV)
R 695 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9550 128MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView
R 795 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9550 256MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView
R 795 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9600 Pro 128MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView
R 995 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon 9600 Pro 256MB 128Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView
R 2,950 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon X800 Pro 256MB 256Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView
R 3,950 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon X800 XT 256MB 256Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView
R 4,950 Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon X800 XT Platinum 256MB 256Bit, D-SUB+ DVI+ TV-OUT, DirectX 9 + OpenGL, Dual RAMDACs, MultiView

hope that helps

[Silent_Bob]

Firstly smokalot, where are you situated? I buy all my pc hardware from my mates bussines in Durban, I just built my self a new pc last week, I purchased a Chaintech PCI-E 6600Gt and it pumps! it plays games beautifully and i would highly reccomend it, I paid R1569.78 or i can get u a different brand for 1362.30 but also a 6600GT. I went Amd with my pc and i chose the ASUS a8n-SlI for 1313.28 it is new technology compatible and it has every feature u could imagine. Hope this helps, o ya, PCI-E makes a huge difference!

[Perdition]

No PCI-E does not make a huge difference, current cards don't even push the limits of AGP 8x. The reason you should go PCI-E is that it is the new standard and thus more futureproof than AGP.

I agree on the 6600GT, if you really want to play games you'll be wasting your money on anything less.

[Angellus]

.

[jjtoymachine]

i would recommend that you get the 128bit 9550, preferably the makes: asus, saphire, gecube. I can then show hot to safely OC that card to 9600PRO levels, and even 9600XT levels, if you feeling brave i can also show you how to flash a 9600PRO bios onto the card :). but remmember if you take my advise, get the 128bit version, one of the makes above, and get the 128MB version also the 256MB shows no performance increase and i harder to OC.

[Celemasiko]

To me, my Nvidia Geforce 6800 is the best card I ever had. Better then the ATI I had before.

[killadoob]

9550 is hardly better than my old 9200

ati's low end cards are expensive

[Luke7777]

There's no reason not to seriously consider a PCI-e mobo when building a new pc.

[h0ll0w]

No PCI-E does not make a huge difference, current cards don't even push the limits of AGP 8x. The reason you should go PCI-E is that it is the new standard and thus more futureproof than AGP.

It is obvious that it in fact current AGP cards must have hit the limit of 8X AGP, otherwise there would have been no reason for intel to replace their own AGP standard with a new one.

My suggestion for a upgrade would be : AMD64 3000+/3200+(socket 939), 512MB RAM (can always upgrade to 1024), GF 6600gt. You wont regret forking out an extra R1000 on a graphics card.

[smokalot]

Firstly smokalot, where are you situated? I buy all my pc hardware from my mates bussines in Durban, I just built my self a new pc last week, I purchased a Chaintech PCI-E 6600Gt and it pumps! it plays games beautifully and i would highly reccomend it, I paid R1569.78 or i can get u a different brand for 1362.30 but also a 6600GT. I went Amd with my pc and i chose the ASUS a8n-SlI for 1313.28 it is new technology compatible and it has every feature u could imagine. Hope this helps, o ya, PCI-E makes a huge difference!

Yo Silent_Bob

I am in Jhb. I pretty much have access to dealer prices but thatnks for your offer. So you reckon PCI-e is the way to go aswell?

Thanks for your advice man :)

[smokalot]

AMEN. Thanx for finally sorting out the PCI-E issue, has no advantage yet. Good Idea to buy sli mobo cos like PCI-E will give you better upgrade option. You always have the option to go SLI if you need to.

Angellus and Perdition - your advice makes alot of sense. So it seems considering PCI-e would only be worth it for future upgrades and NOT better performance (or value)

[smokalot]

Not many ATI spporters here.??? :confused:

[Toxin]

And definitely try to get an SLI mobo. It gives you the freedom to upgrade for less when you decide to. Two decent 6600GT cards running in SLI can actually beat a 6800GT. Ok, when you push the graphics to the limit the 6800GT will probably still come out tops, but that's still not too bad. Especially since you pay less for two 6600GT cards than for a single 6800GT. The only problem with SLI is that some of the older games won't be able to utilise it.

EDIT: Before I forget ATI will also start showing their dual card thing called Crossfire. I haven't seen any reviews yet, but I'll still stick to Nvidia

[Luke7777]

Careful of SLI. It does NOT support multi-monitor with SLI enabled. SLI *will* disable your 2nd monitor on startup. The newer cards do allow for a soft switch (without reboot), but mine still requires a reboot. Needless to say I abandoned my 2 CRT monitors and opted for a quality LCD instead. If you run a single monitor, no problem

[martin]

I just helped my roommate put together his new PC. He opted for a Sparkle 6600GT PCI-E. I'm was very impressed with this card. Doom 3 on it's highest graphic settings ran like a dream.

[Luke7777]

Regarding the SLI option and older games, the current driver (from 71.84 in fact) does allow you to build a profile for those games, in conjunction with the coolbits tweak. HardOCP (http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NzQ3) has more about it

[RoosTa]

If you go for ATI, you should only go for X800 Pro and up, Nvidia's mid range cards are much better overall, but ATI's X800 XT still holds the record for the fastest non-sli card.

[stoke]

ATI - well - personally, I had huge crap with ATI's drivers for my "All in Wonder". I had zero help from ATI support, the only help I actually managed to get was from NVidea - for an ATI card - rediculous. But that's just me being bias.

Watchout - ATI have an upgrade swap-plan thing which could save you a fortune in upgrades. Well - now I cannot find any details of this plan. Maybee I woz dreaming.

[gkm]

I think SLI is a waste of time, except if you plan to buy two video cards today. If you buy one now and want more speed in a year or two, then you will need to buy an antique card at that stage to match the one you already have for SLI. Buying a single new card at that stage will probably give more speed with less hassles. And then you save the money you would have forked out for the SLI board.

On PCIe vs AGP, actually even AGP capacity is not used up yet, which is why PCIe is not giving any performance benefits for video cards. It just gives more flexibility for the design people, like for example making SLI possible. However, it is going to get harder in the long run to get proper AGP video cards, which is why I think it is a bad idea to buy an AGP board now. But there is no reason yet to throw out an existing AGP board if one already has one.

[killadoob]

well the only reason to change is because all cards will be pci-e so ppl can change their boards. its all a money making thing.

[Toxin]

But you have to believe that someday games are going to come out that either require only PCI-e, or utilise it to it's full potential.

[futron]

well the only reason to change is because all cards will be pci-e so ppl can change their boards. its all a money making thing.


So true, but still we need new technology to develop to keep the market going and in an sense keep food in some of our homes - not true ??
Funny thing though I am running an AGP Nvidia 5700 on an AMD 64 3000+ with 1024Mg Ram and still get hours of fun with great graphics on high end games, why spend R 1500.00+ now while u can still get the same performance on a lower end card (±R 350.00) and wait a while for prices to drop when the PCI-e rush hits the market, this is usually what I do with all new Graphics cards and then buy when prices fall which always happens.

[eye_suc]

hehehe, ja nee, SLI is sly. If you use the same graphics card with different BIOS versions it wont work. And you MUST use the EXACT SAME card, so gkm is absolutely right. SLI is not an option for "get-a-card-in-the-future".

PCI is also not really that much of a benefit. Prices are a bit lower than AGP already, but thats about it. Performance wise, who gives a toss over 1 or 2 frames? But it is still a must have for future proofing.

ATI ALL THE WAY!!! But because they so expensive i've got a 6600GT. awesome value for money

[RoosTa]

Funny thing though I am running an AGP Nvidia 5700 on an AMD 64 3000+ with 1024Mg Ram and still get hours of fun with great graphics on high end games, why spend R 1500.00+ now while u can still get the same performance on a lower end card (±R 350.00) I have to disagree with you. 5700's uses old technology and it has really bad image quality. 6600GT has Pixel Shaders 3.0, which means that it can run Unreal Engine 3.0, when the games are released (and there are quite a few developers that have signed up for UE3). 5700 doesn't even support pixel shader 2.0, which is being used in today's games with great effect.

If you really don't have the cash, stick with ATI 9600, because it does support pixel shader 2.0 and plays today's games with all the effects and great image quality at reasonable frame rates.

[FireFLi]

ehehe, ja nee, SLI is sly. If you use the same graphics card with different BIOS versions it wont work. And you MUST use the EXACT SAME card, so gkm is absolutely right. SLI is not an option for "get-a-card-in-the-future".

Surely you can flash the BIOS on these cards so they are the same?

[futron]

I have to disagree with you. 5700's uses old technology and it has really bad image quality. 6600GT has Pixel Shaders 3.0, which means that it can run Unreal Engine 3.0, when the games are released (and there are quite a few developers that have signed up for UE3). 5700 doesn't even support pixel shader 2.0, which is being used in today's games with great effect.

If you really don't have the cash, stick with ATI 9600, because it does support pixel shader 2.0 and plays today's games with all the effects and great image quality at reasonable frame rates.


LaRoosta u missing the point I did not say don't buy the card all I said was that I am still using a 5700 with great effect and will wait till prices drop why spend R 1500.00 now when I can wait a couple of months and save R 500 or more UT3 still has a long way b4 being released and yes prolly by then I will have a card capable of cranking out max graphics on it but to spend an amount on something just because its the in thing and for the oohs and aahs is not my style - I love great graphics but i'm not willing to spend money on something which I can do without for a while longer till prices drop and I can do upgrades on not only Graphics but maybe memmory also - see :p

[Luke7777]

Yip FireFli, the *current* requirements are identical cards, incl bios, and yes, you can flash them

[diabolus]

Heh you guys certainly are on a different planet. I play my games on my Nvidia FX5200 just fine [yes that is the cheapest possible card you can get right now]. My next buy option would be an ATI 9600XT/Pro , simply because as far as i can tell for the price-range it is the better option. As far as PCI-e vs AGP, if i "Happen" to upgrade now, yes i'd look into getting a board with PCI-e slots, but i certainly wouldn't look at a card and then upgrade the board just to get a certain card in, chances are when PCI-e really overtakes AGP then the boards will also really be better than having quasi AGP/PCI-e boards. So in a way i would rather wait before buying a new board JUST to get PCI-e slots.

If youre hardcore gamer really concerned with framerates i guess going for a R2k+ card is a must, but really you CAN run most [if not all] games just fine on a R500 card, GIVEN you have a good PC to back it up. If i can play Farcry on 1024x760 at "medium" [which is as far as i'm concerned : good enough] on my GF5200 without any hiccups then i'm happy [which is indeed the case].

[smokalot]

Heh you guys certainly are on a different planet. I play my games on my Nvidia FX5200 just fine [yes that is the cheapest possible card you can get right now]. My next buy option would be an ATI 9600XT/Pro , simply because as far as i can tell for the price-range it is the better option. As far as PCI-e vs AGP, if i "Happen" to upgrade now, yes i'd look into getting a board with PCI-e slots, but i certainly wouldn't look at a card and then upgrade the board just to get a certain card in, chances are when PCI-e really overtakes AGP then the boards will also really be better than having quasi AGP/PCI-e boards. So in a way i would rather wait before buying a new board JUST to get PCI-e slots.

If youre hardcore gamer really concerned with framerates i guess going for a R2k+ card is a must, but really you CAN run most [if not all] games just fine on a R500 card, GIVEN you have a good PC to back it up. If i can play Farcry on 1024x760 at "medium" [which is as far as i'm concerned : good enough] on my GF5200 without any hiccups then i'm happy [which is indeed the case].


diabolus

You posting gives me a little comfort and makes sense. What has been worrying that everyone pushing for medium to high-end cards in order to just run modern games DECENTLY.

I have provisionally added PCI-express Gigabyte nVidia GeForce 6600GT to my new PC spec because according to all the comments on this forum and very recent international comparisons, it is par for the course!

I do agree though with getting a motherboard that supports PCI-e and DDR2 for that matter although that does push the price up slightly but I feel it is worth it considering the upgradability issue.

[jjtoymachine]

What has been worrying that everyone pushing for medium to high-end cards in order to just run modern games DECENTLY.


dude, run a few searches on the net about the 9550 128bit and see its overclocking abilities, OC ATI cards is great cause you can use tools such as ATI tool which allows for dynamic OCing, meaning your card only OCs when you play games. I dont have an insanely great setup:
2500+ Barton
Nforce 2 Ultra Mobo
Asus 9550 128MB 128Bit (Goes for around R700)
512MB Ram

And i can play Doom 3 at 1024*768 at high graphics without any slow downs.

I would reccomend that you look at reviews of the cards you are interested in on the net, as this forum is not 'big' enough to take advise on in regards to hardware

[jjtoymachine]

9550 is hardly better than my old 9200

ati's low end cards are expensive
u obviously have never tried pushing this card. IT IS THE SAME CARD AS THE 9600 PRO, just with lower clock speeds. Dont believe me...run a search on the net!

[Perdition]

It is obvious that it in fact current AGP cards must have hit the limit of 8X AGP, otherwise there would have been no reason for intel to replace their own AGP standard with a new one.

Not so. The introduction PCI-e has nothing to do with the "bandwidth contraints" of AGP but rather as a replacement for the (now rather old) PCI interface. AGP was introduced because at the time PCI could no longer handle the bandwidth requirements of video cards but now that PCI has been updated there is no reason for AGP to exist anymore... simple as that.

@jjtoymachine: I agree that he should read some reviews but I recommend against overclocking unless you know what you're doing. He just wants a machine that runs games well at standard speeds.

The 6600GT is a good card because it runs most games very well and has full Direct X 9.0c (i.e. Shader 3.0) support and at a decent price point. Also nVidia has far better Linux support than ATI.

[jjtoymachine]

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=2716
incase anyone does wanna try, OC the 9550 does not increase the temps as much as other cards as this card is a crippled 9600 Pro

[smokalot]

Also nVidia has far better Linux support than ATI.

Sounds good - do you know if the Boxed package (6600) comes with Linux drivers?

[Luke7777]

Does it matter when you can get it right here (http://www.nvidia.com/object/unix.html) ?

[eye_suc]

Surely you can flash the BIOS on these cards so they are the same?

Yes you can, apparently, although flashing the BIOS voids your warrantee/guarantee, right?

In any case, telling a casual gamer who does not spend much time with pc's to quickly flash his BIOS is prolly not a great idea.

Stick with one board sollutions :) if you really have money, go for the big guns.

[Luke7777]

See no reason why flashing bios with an *official* version will void warrantees. Different story when you start flashing with tweaked bios versions not originating from the manuacturer. Hope you don't mean onboard as in "onboard vga"

[eye_suc]

Hehehe, nope, one board (as in single), not onboard!!! YUCK!

In the end, whichever card you choose it seems it doesnt effect gameplay too much. Brother-in-law went and got a brand spanking new p4 2.8 HT with onboard gpu 256mb ram. Pretty decent cpu though, so i gave him my old radeon 9000 pro. WOW! You should see the bloody games run on that thing now! I was flippen de mewr in.

I guess the better the overall system the less dependant you are on your graphics card.

[Luke7777]

:o sorry, just reread the "one board" line again

[smokalot]

Does it matter when you can get it right here (http://www.nvidia.com/object/unix.html) ?

I guess not - just wondering though.
:D
Nice one Luke!

[FireFLi]

I have bought an SLI board with the view to buying an additional card in the future when the technology has matured and more game developers are taking advantage of the technology.

I cannot believe that manufactures haven't forseen this scenario and will probably release software to flash GPU BIOS (with official version) to make cards SLI compatible. (this is an effective way of ensuring sales :p )

[Luke7777]

Rumours have that ATI will allow different cards i.e. X800 & X850 to be SLI'd

[FireFLi]

Will be interesting to see if that is true. At the moment nVidia have got the jump on them, and SLI should be well on it's way by the time crossfire is released. Interesting times. :D

[Angellus]

.

[jjtoymachine]

i wonder why the never opted for dual core technology...i read a article around a year ago about ATI testing dual core technology, never heard anything after that...probrally lies

[gkm]

i wonder why the never opted for dual core technology...i read a article around a year ago about ATI testing dual core technology, never heard anything after that...probrally lies

Graphics cards work in terms of pipelines, so in some sense they are already multi-core. I doubt if "dual core"-ness in the CPU sense would be interesting for GPU's. They already have a gazillion transistors, so I suspect having two together would kill production yields.

[Angellus]

.

[RoosTa]

LaRoosta u missing the point I did not say don't buy the card all I said was that I am still using a 5700 with great effect and will wait till prices drop why spend R 1500.00 now when I can wait a couple of months and save R 500 or more UT3 still has a long way b4 being released and yes prolly by then I will have a card capable of cranking out max graphics on it but to spend an amount on something just because its the in thing and for the oohs and aahs is not my style - I love great graphics but i'm not willing to spend money on something which I can do without for a while longer till prices drop and I can do upgrades on not only Graphics but maybe memmory also - see


...when I can wait a couple of months...

Heh, maybe you don't understand THE point. :P

He wants to play games today and not wait for another 6 months before 6600GT's technology becomes old and sells for 'cheep-cheep'. In that case 9600 will be perfect for the budget man, but if you want to future proof yourself and play tomorrow's games as well, it will be worth his while to fish out the extra dosh and not have to worry about asking these questions in a year's time.

The trick, is to find the 'sweet' spot when to buy and sell. The 6600GT is the current sweet spot. Hence the term best-bang-for-buck.

It is not my intention to discredit you in anyway, but in my honest and humble oppinion, the 5700 isn't a bad card, but you could have done much better in terms of bang-for-buck. Bang-for-buck is what you should aim for since it will last you through the next generation and not cost you an arm-and-a-leg. If something is cheap, its cheap for a reason.

[diabolus]

In the end, whichever card you choose it seems it doesnt effect gameplay too much. Brother-in-law went and got a brand spanking new p4 2.8 HT with onboard gpu 256mb ram. Pretty decent cpu though, so i gave him my old radeon 9000 pro. WOW! You should see the bloody games run on that thing now! I was flippen de mewr in.


Exactly :P Which is why i was rather surprised how everyone is pushing the R2000+ cards here as the only way to play games decently. I also got a P4 3.0Ghz HT with 1GB RAM and heck, Prince of Persia : Warrior Within runs with my -onboard- graphics just fine [SiS DirectX 9c card, lacking some shader features mainly]. So adding my "old" FX5200 only improved things. Obviously can't push my settings full blown, have to tweak stuff a bit with anti-aliasing levels and so forth, but i have not ran across a game i could not play "Decently" yet.

But if you got the cash, i guess go for it. I just dont think it is the alpha and omega to have a high end card. Plus in my case, there is the typical irony of older games [starcraft? ] ending up staying much longer on my system than intended......

[Angellus]

.

[Chris]

Yes, spend some extra dosh and you'll reap in the rewards. I mean you guys on a FX5200 probably think that is it fine but the questions I ask you is:

A) Don't you want to improve performance
B) Have you seen in real-life how a card like a Geforce 6600GT/6800GT/Ultra perfom.


Which is why i was rather surprised how everyone is pushing the R2000+ cards here as the only way to play games decently. I also got a P4 3.0Ghz HT with 1GB RAM and heck, Prince of Persia : Warrior Within runs with my -onboard- graphics just fine [SiS DirectX 9c card, lacking some shader features mainly]. So adding my "old" FX5200 only improved things. Obviously can't push my settings full blown, have to tweak stuff a bit with anti-aliasing levels and so forth, but i have not ran across a game i could not play "Decently" yet.

The P4 3Ghz and 1GB RAM helped alot in this instance. However the gfx card will always be the main driver in improving game performance.

[RoosTa]

In the end it all comes down to; How much money are YOU willing to spend on a PC. It's all relative;

1) Buy a cheap card:
- You save money
- You'll get decent quality and performance in older games
- You'll get bad performance and quality in newer games
- Don't expect it to play new games a year from now
- Maybe struggle to sell the card (or prepare to hand it over to family member)

2) Spend your life savings on a top performer
- Very Expensive
- You'll get brilliant quality and performance in old games
- You'll get excellent quality and performace in new games with all bells and whistle on
- It will out last most cards on today's market
- You'll easily be able to sell it, though it does loose value rather quickly

3) Best bang for buck
- A bit more than you've budgeted
- You'll get brilliant quality and performance in old games
- You'll get excellent quality and performace in new games with most bells and whistle on
- It will almost last as long as the top performer
- You should still be able to sell it for a good price

Just plan your upgrades properly. Get price lists and do proper research, write down all the good and bad points of each 'contender' from several sources. This will make the choice a bit more easier.

[gkm]

I also do not think integrated graphics is good for games, except for example FreeCell.
http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040211/index.html

The article says in the conclusion:

The results of this comparison are sobering. Integrated graphics chips represent the lowest level of graphics performance available in the market today. Even inexpensive add-in cards in the $50 price category play in another performance league altogether.

[freeek]

mid range cards are the best to buy... My current top seller is 6600GT's
I can offer:
Sparkly nvidia AGP 8x / PCI-E 16x 6600GT's 128mb/128bit 500/1000(not sure think so)
R1450 (oem packaging tho)

[Luke7777]

LaRoosTa, personally I like to do a little combo between points 2 & 3 , especially when I built a new pc. I' like to future proof (3 years) my mobo even if I have to spent a bit more. Then I look at best bang for the buck CPU and GPU which could possibly last the 3 years. Upgrade possibilites is not my main intention when making these decisions, but if my gfx card or cpu dies, I don't want to do an unplanned mobo upgrade as well . Having built new in Feb/March, my mobo *had* to be PCI-e and Socket 939. Chose the ASUS A8N-SLID as basis. Combined with AMD64 3200 and a single 6600GT, I had my bang for the buck. Then my heart told my brain to take a hike and I added another 6600GT. I knew that I probably was not going to add another 6600GT in a year's time (what's the chances of finding an identical card anyway) and 6600GT SLI was still cheaper than a single 6800 with similiar performance.

(My) Moral of the story :
If you're going to built a new pc, think ahead and do your homework, and yes, it's going to cost more.
If you're looking to upgrade, then upgrade ram or cpu or gpu, on the *existing* mobo. To me a new mobo should involve new technology and be complemented by the necessary hardware

[jjtoymachine]

hey guy plz take a look 4 me :)
http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php?t=22224

[rburley]

what about mid range ATi's?

[craigsa]

**** i thought my x800 pro was good !!

[rburley]

When is the next range of mid-range cards comming out? I wanna get the 6600gt but i think the 7600 will be out soon and dont want to waste my money

[freeek]

7800's and new x900's will probs only come out in december or mayb even next yr some time. 6600GT's is the most worth it card 2 buy currently ... i got one (msi!) go for it

[rburley]

7800's and new x900's will probs only come out in december or mayb even next yr some time. 6600GT's is the most worth it card 2 buy currently ... i got one (msi!) go for it

what are you alking about 7800's are already available ;)
http://www.computersonly.co.za/

[peered95]

ASUS 6600GT are the best way to go (middle range)

[rburley]

I was thinking about the 6600gt.
3d marks???

[Luke7777]

don't have a single card figure. AMD64 3200 & ASUS 6600GT SLI (stock) gives me 6190 in 3D Mark '05. single would probably between 3000 and 3500

[gkm]

A friend of mine has an MSI 6600GT with an AMD64 3.5 and he gets 3400 with 3DMark2005.

[h0ll0w]

I can also vouch for the ASUS 6600gt, good manufacturer. I've installed a few by now and havent had a single complaint. :)

[smokalot]

From what most have said the nVidia® GeForce 6600GT seems to be the fore-runner at this point (If you want to spend a bit but not your life savings on a gfx card.

But where are all the ATI fans?! Is it a Linux/Windows issue?

[jackdaniels]

get a nvidia TNT2, I bought one for 1500 yesterday and it runs quake 3 well

[useless]

get a nvidia TNT2, I bought one for 1500 yesterday and it runs quake 3 well

overclocked?

[eye_suc]

erm, tnt2? R1500? sheesh, thats what a 6600gt costs. my tnt2 didnt cost R1500 ... 5 or 6 years ago!

[useless]

you've been visiting incredible ripoff again?

[lilgindauk]

get the new nvidia range!
appaerntly its got 16x anti-aliasing and ut2007 runs at 70-90fps on full everything!

[jackdaniels]

get the new nvidia range!
appaerntly its got 16x anti-aliasing and ut2007 runs at 70-90fps on full everything!

lildork- i prefer ati

[Chris]

ligindauk - you do talk the biggest load of BS I've ever heard. UT2007 is not even out yet you chop.

[Angellus]

.

[Chris]

Yep and the system they use do demo it uses 6800Ultra SLI and that only barely runs it. So where this 70-90FPS I don't know.True abou the AA though.

I think he was talking about SLI'ed Geforce 7800GTX's...

[jackdaniels]

I see that nvidia is bringing out a TNT3 with 512 bus and 512 GDDR ram and with 1500 MHz GPU.

[Angellus]

.

[peered95]

Thoses figures look about right...

[rburley]

I see that nvidia is bringing out a TNT3 with 512 bus and 512 GDDR ram and with 1500 MHz GPU.

ya sure thing

[peered95]

they will...just not soon

[Toxin]

Can someone please PM me the price of the ASUS 6600GT SLI? I need to budget for it and I'd like to know in what price range it can be in. Getting the ASUS SLI-D with AMD64 3200+ as well.

[Learning]

yes i hear you guys, 6600gt rocks

i want a R200 not R300

can you guys find comparisons for 6200 vs 9600

ive looked high and low :confused:

thankyou

Confused :confused:

[rburley]

yes i hear you guys, 6600gt rocks

i want a R200 not R300

can you guys find comparisons for 6200 vs 9600

ive looked high and low :confused:

thankyou

Confused :confused:

The 9600 is a lot older than the 6200 but the 6200 is bottom of the range card and the 9600 is a mid range card so I dunno...

I would go for the 9600XT 256, I have one and it still works well

[smokalot]

:)

Thanks for everyone's input into this topic!

It was huge. I am going with the GeForce PCIx 6600GT unless something else suddenly comes up.

Thanks again!

:cool:

[nrg_wp]

The 6800 128 LE - budget card. might be better than 6600GT 256... and cheaper. look into it.

[useless]

both 6600 and 6800 128 LE have 12 pipes if i recall.. but i would go for the 6600GT 256 just for the RAM amount.... you can unlock the other 4 pipes but that voids the warranty...

[nrg_wp]

You can unlock the pipes on the 6800 as well....
Most benchmarks i checked out, the 6800 LE does better. But then again, BF2 is texture hungry... so i dont know...
The 6800LE is definately faster in DOOM3 than the 6600GT...

[useless]

i suppose its just a matter of choice and wallet expenditure... :)

[nrg_wp]

im still deciding, 6600GT or 6800LE... or maybe i should just sell my left kidney and buy a full blown 6800

[FireFLi]

Got a 6800GT... loving it! Can run WoW with all the bells and whistles on and achieve +-60fps at 1280 x 1024. I see now that the 7800 is out the one I purchased is R500 cheaper :rolleyes:

[useless]

WoW aint that demanding on hardware, i also run it at full blast in WoW... to be honest the 7800GTX only gives you more AA and AF, no new tech to boast about yet...

[FireFLi]

Oh... only game I am playing at the mo (huge difference in comparison to my old GeForce 2). Actually upgraded in anticipation of AoE3.

[Perdition]

I had a GeForce 2 before my 6800 GT and I agree the difference is incredible, runs all games at highest detail settings with no problem.

[FireFLi]

I think the major benefit of the 6800GT only starts to kick in at high end resolutions as far as I can remember. Yes there isn't much difference between the 6600 and 6800 and lower resolutions. But crank up the res and see how the performance on the 6600 starts to take strain. Anyway that's how I justified the HUGE outlay :p

Now all have to do is sell my other kidney for my SLi setup :D

[SlimJim]

ati man.. ati all the way
earlier this i bought the x850xt and price over performance, it wins hands down
sli is far too much for what it is and far to limited... bring on crossfire