Synaesthesia
22-07-2010, 01:18 PM
I suppose it has to be writing phone-specific drivers for things like the baseband and power management, otherwise why else are we having to wait so long to get Froyo onto all the new Android phones?
View Full Version : What is holding back manufacturers from implementing Froyo?
Maddmatt
22-07-2010, 01:32 PM
Maybe because it gives you a reason to buy a newer phone. They do less work, but get more profit :p
cyb3rt
22-07-2010, 01:40 PM
Just go beyond the manufacturer and root the phone if it is able to. A whole new world of opportunities open up if you do so... I am not going to go into details or argue with anybody, but rooting is the best option for anybody imo...
Pilgrim
22-07-2010, 02:44 PM
Just go beyond the manufacturer and root the phone if it is able to. A whole new world of opportunities open up if you do so... I am not going to go into details or argue with anybody, but rooting is the best option for anybody imo...
+1000
HTC, Leaf etc have ZERO reason to keep your 2 month old phone up to date, they would rather have you buy the brand spanking new new NEW Android phone.
Root it, update it.
I am currently running Android 1.6 on my G1, waiting for v6 of Cyanogenmod to go stable then I will be running 2.2 on it :D
Root your phone, it is the right thing to do.
+1000
HTC, Leaf etc have ZERO reason to keep your 2 month old phone up to date, they would rather have you buy the brand spanking new new NEW Android phone.
Root it, update it.
I am currently running Android 1.6 on my G1, waiting for v6 of Cyanogenmod to go stable then I will be running 2.2 on it :D
Root your phone, it is the right thing to do.
Chunkyfeather
22-07-2010, 03:15 PM
But rooting voids you warranty?
cyb3rt
22-07-2010, 03:53 PM
But rooting voids you warranty?
Yes, but you can unroot it and make it 'good' again.
Yes, but you can unroot it and make it 'good' again.
Synaesthesia
22-07-2010, 06:38 PM
OK but how's the performance, specifically battery life and stability with a rooted Froyo phone? Why aren't manufacturers doing the same thing, when some random XDA developer can throw together a ROM?
I mean, they're stupid not to do it, it would be a big customer draw. Imagine if HTC released Froyo ROMs for it's Android range, it would entice a lot of people to buy HTC. I don't get it!
I mean, they're stupid not to do it, it would be a big customer draw. Imagine if HTC released Froyo ROMs for it's Android range, it would entice a lot of people to buy HTC. I don't get it!
Synaesthesia
22-07-2010, 06:44 PM
Ars Technica: Bloatware creeping into some Android phones.
(http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2010/07/bloatware-creeps-into-android-phones.ars)
Great, some manufacturers are now preloading bloatware, which you cannot remove onto their phones.
I think I've found my reason: most phone manufacturers don't care about software, or user experience. Or they care, but they have incompetent design teams. It's what gave Apple an opportunity in the market in the first place.
Don't get me wrong, I love Android! But this is rubbish! I'd probably get a Nexus One if I were to get an Android phone.
(http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2010/07/bloatware-creeps-into-android-phones.ars)
Great, some manufacturers are now preloading bloatware, which you cannot remove onto their phones.
I think I've found my reason: most phone manufacturers don't care about software, or user experience. Or they care, but they have incompetent design teams. It's what gave Apple an opportunity in the market in the first place.
Don't get me wrong, I love Android! But this is rubbish! I'd probably get a Nexus One if I were to get an Android phone.
cyb3rt
22-07-2010, 07:41 PM
OK but how's the performance, specifically battery life and stability with a rooted Froyo phone?!
I have not noticed any difference to be honest. I had to charge my phone every night when it was stock, and I still need to while on a froyo ROM. There are tons of stuff to do to improve it, but mine holds me the whole day with moderate/extensive usage until I go to bed between 9-11pm with around 20-25% battery left. So for me to do all these things to make the battery better is useless, cause I'm going to have to charge it anyway every night to get a full day's usage.
Ars Technica: Bloatware creeping into some Android phones.
(http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2010/07/bloatware-creeps-into-android-phones.ars)
Great, some manufacturers are now preloading bloatware, which you cannot remove onto their phones.
I think I've found my reason: most phone manufacturers don't care about software, or user experience. Or they care, but they have incompetent design teams. It's what gave Apple an opportunity in the market in the first place.
Don't get me wrong, I love Android! But this is rubbish! I'd probably get a Nexus One if I were to get an Android phone.
With root you can do pretty much anything so these things don't bother me at all.
I have not noticed any difference to be honest. I had to charge my phone every night when it was stock, and I still need to while on a froyo ROM. There are tons of stuff to do to improve it, but mine holds me the whole day with moderate/extensive usage until I go to bed between 9-11pm with around 20-25% battery left. So for me to do all these things to make the battery better is useless, cause I'm going to have to charge it anyway every night to get a full day's usage.
Ars Technica: Bloatware creeping into some Android phones.
(http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2010/07/bloatware-creeps-into-android-phones.ars)
Great, some manufacturers are now preloading bloatware, which you cannot remove onto their phones.
I think I've found my reason: most phone manufacturers don't care about software, or user experience. Or they care, but they have incompetent design teams. It's what gave Apple an opportunity in the market in the first place.
Don't get me wrong, I love Android! But this is rubbish! I'd probably get a Nexus One if I were to get an Android phone.
With root you can do pretty much anything so these things don't bother me at all.
Synaesthesia
22-07-2010, 09:14 PM
I have not noticed any difference to be honest. I had to charge my phone every night when it was stock, and I still need to while on a froyo ROM. There are tons of stuff to do to improve it, but mine holds me the whole day with moderate/extensive usage until I go to bed between 9-11pm with around 20-25% battery left. So for me to do all these things to make the battery better is useless, cause I'm going to have to charge it anyway every night to get a full day's usage.
OK that's fine, so there's really no excuse!
It's just that I'm so excited about Froyo, have been since the I/O conference. You get huge performance increases thanks to the JIT Dalkvik interpreter. That alone should get every cellphone maker working furiously to get it on their device already!
OK that's fine, so there's really no excuse!
It's just that I'm so excited about Froyo, have been since the I/O conference. You get huge performance increases thanks to the JIT Dalkvik interpreter. That alone should get every cellphone maker working furiously to get it on their device already!
DJNgoma
22-07-2010, 09:50 PM
OK that's fine, so there's really no excuse!
It's just that I'm so excited about Froyo, have been since the I/O conference. You get huge performance increases thanks to the JIT Dalkvik interpreter. That alone should get every cellphone maker working furiously to get it on their device already!
Kind of disappointing to see the likes of Sony Ericsson still have their Xperia X10 running on 1.6 and only offer 2.1 in Q4 of the year. You can't load any custom ROMs on it yet due to the bootloader.
It's just that I'm so excited about Froyo, have been since the I/O conference. You get huge performance increases thanks to the JIT Dalkvik interpreter. That alone should get every cellphone maker working furiously to get it on their device already!
Kind of disappointing to see the likes of Sony Ericsson still have their Xperia X10 running on 1.6 and only offer 2.1 in Q4 of the year. You can't load any custom ROMs on it yet due to the bootloader.
duncan1a
22-07-2010, 10:12 PM
Kind of disappointing to see the likes of Sony Ericsson still have their Xperia X10 running on 1.6 and only offer 2.1 in Q4 of the year.
Q4 - Just in time for Gingerbread! Ahh, I love my Nexus :-)
Q4 - Just in time for Gingerbread! Ahh, I love my Nexus :-)
francoislr
23-07-2010, 12:00 AM
I custom rom-med my Tytn 2, and before I took it in for a warranty repair(hardware) I flashed the rom that Leaf provided me with. Phone got fixed, not a peep from MTN about any warranty stuff. The only thing is, the day my phone went in, I had my Desire 24 hours later;-)
Also, updates are tough. First from Google, then to HTC, then to Leaf, and then to MTN/Vodacon...each needs approval, then they add their crap to it. The process takes way too long! Custom roms, the moment Google releases them goes straight to the developers, and then gets assembled and distributed for street cred. Much faster process, as they don't bother waiting for companies like vodacom/icasa/leaf to approve...they just do. So proper updates will never have the turn around speed custom roms have.
Also, updates are tough. First from Google, then to HTC, then to Leaf, and then to MTN/Vodacon...each needs approval, then they add their crap to it. The process takes way too long! Custom roms, the moment Google releases them goes straight to the developers, and then gets assembled and distributed for street cred. Much faster process, as they don't bother waiting for companies like vodacom/icasa/leaf to approve...they just do. So proper updates will never have the turn around speed custom roms have.
Synaesthesia
23-07-2010, 01:16 AM
OK that clarifies it, but it's still rubbish. Very irritating that the carriers need to approve and/or add crap to your software. I thought Apple showed that you don't have to put up with it.
Chunkyfeather
23-07-2010, 07:36 AM
Yes, but you can unroot it and make it 'good' again.
But not if your phone is dead :-(
But not if your phone is dead :-(
cyb3rt
23-07-2010, 07:41 AM
But not if your phone is dead :-(
Meaning?
Meaning?
Chunkyfeather
23-07-2010, 08:17 AM
If my phone dies (hardware related), the manufacturers would fix it under warranty, i am sure they will see I have rooted phone and charge for the repairs and void the warranty?
If im wrong, then im rooting this weekend. Root root, i mean woot woot!
If im wrong, then im rooting this weekend. Root root, i mean woot woot!
cyb3rt
23-07-2010, 08:36 AM
If my phone dies (hardware related), the manufacturers would fix it under warranty, i am sure they will see I have rooted phone and charge for the repairs and void the warranty?
If im wrong, then im rooting this weekend. Root root, i mean woot woot!
Yeah damn, I don't know what would happen if thats the case...
If im wrong, then im rooting this weekend. Root root, i mean woot woot!
Yeah damn, I don't know what would happen if thats the case...
alt146
23-07-2010, 08:42 AM
OK that clarifies it, but it's still rubbish. Very irritating that the carriers need to approve and/or add crap to your software. I thought Apple showed that you don't have to put up with it.
The difference is that if a modder puts out a rom with a few niggles, he just puts in a disclaimer, puts it in his to-do list and all is well. If whatever is wrong is important then people just dont download his rom, else they just live with the missing functionality. If there's a bug or something that the modder missed a user will report it and shrug it off because it's custom mod, there is always a bug or two. Or flash to something else, whatever, the modding community is way more forgiving because they know what the deal is and are glad to be getting something they wouldnt otherwise get.. For a corporation to do something like that would be seen as unacceptable, especially from the standpoint of the layman phone user. There has to be tons of testing and checking to make sure everything works perfectly. And all the people involved with the phone will want to do the checks too - Vodacom won't approve something if they have to deal with people bringing it in because the bluetooth stopped working, leaf doesnt want to have to deal with tons of phones being sent in for software issues.
The difference is that if a modder puts out a rom with a few niggles, he just puts in a disclaimer, puts it in his to-do list and all is well. If whatever is wrong is important then people just dont download his rom, else they just live with the missing functionality. If there's a bug or something that the modder missed a user will report it and shrug it off because it's custom mod, there is always a bug or two. Or flash to something else, whatever, the modding community is way more forgiving because they know what the deal is and are glad to be getting something they wouldnt otherwise get.. For a corporation to do something like that would be seen as unacceptable, especially from the standpoint of the layman phone user. There has to be tons of testing and checking to make sure everything works perfectly. And all the people involved with the phone will want to do the checks too - Vodacom won't approve something if they have to deal with people bringing it in because the bluetooth stopped working, leaf doesnt want to have to deal with tons of phones being sent in for software issues.
clof
23-07-2010, 10:32 AM
The difference is that if a modder puts out a rom with a few niggles, he just puts in a disclaimer, puts it in his to-do list and all is well. If whatever is wrong is important then people just dont download his rom, else they just live with the missing functionality. If there's a bug or something that the modder missed a user will report it and shrug it off because it's custom mod, there is always a bug or two. Or flash to something else, whatever, the modding community is way more forgiving because they know what the deal is and are glad to be getting something they wouldnt otherwise get.. For a corporation to do something like that would be seen as unacceptable, especially from the standpoint of the layman phone user. There has to be tons of testing and checking to make sure everything works perfectly. And all the people involved with the phone will want to do the checks too - Vodacom won't approve something if they have to deal with people bringing it in because the bluetooth stopped working, leaf doesnt want to have to deal with tons of phones being sent in for software issues.
The modder basically has a huge, diverse group of enthusiastic (and free) alpha\beta testers. the manufacturers have to fit the testing and debugging into their structures and procedures
The modder basically has a huge, diverse group of enthusiastic (and free) alpha\beta testers. the manufacturers have to fit the testing and debugging into their structures and procedures
dakota
23-07-2010, 11:01 AM
But rooting voids you warranty?
Not with HTC (At least not the HTC Desire). The warranty does not mention anything about software except to say that the warranty covers hardware failures and not software.
Not with HTC (At least not the HTC Desire). The warranty does not mention anything about software except to say that the warranty covers hardware failures and not software.
Trix
30-07-2010, 01:02 PM
Can Software cause a hard ware failure. Like an arsonist lighting a match :P
DJNgoma
30-07-2010, 01:11 PM
Can Software cause a hard ware failure. Like an arsonist lighting a match :P
I suppose with an overvolt on the CPU. No sparks unfortunately.
I suppose with an overvolt on the CPU. No sparks unfortunately.
francoislr
30-07-2010, 11:33 PM
Also, the flash for the camera can be used as a torch, but it comes with strong warnings not to overuse it. Don't know if those warnings are from a "oops, I did it, and POOF! GONE!" thing, or the "It's supposed to be used as a flash, so maybe shouldn't use it too much" perspective.