FBI warns of threat from anti-government extremists

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FBI warns of threat from anti-government extremists

(Reuters) - Anti-government extremists opposed to taxes and regulations pose a growing threat to local law enforcement officers in the United States, the FBI warned on Monday.

These extremists, sometimes known as "sovereign citizens," believe they can live outside any type of government authority, FBI agents said at a news conference.

The extremists may refuse to pay taxes, defy government environmental regulations and believe the United States went bankrupt by going off the gold standard.

Routine encounters with police can turn violent "at the drop of a hat," said Stuart McArthur, deputy assistant director in the FBI's counterterrorism division.

"We thought it was important to increase the visibility of the threat with state and local law enforcement," he said.

In May 2010, two West Memphis, Arkansas, police officers were shot and killed in an argument that developed after they pulled over a "sovereign citizen" in traffic.

Last year, an extremist in Texas opened fire on a police officer during a traffic stop. The officer was not hit.

Legal convictions of such extremists, mostly for white-collar crimes such as fraud, have increased from 10 in 2009 to 18 each in 2010 and 2011, FBI agents said.

"We are being inundated right now with requests for training from state and local law enforcement on sovereign-related matters," said Casey Carty, an FBI supervisory special agent.

FBI agents said they do not have a tally of people who consider themselves "sovereign citizens."

J.J. MacNab, a former tax and insurance expert who is an analyst covering the sovereign movement, has estimated that it has about 100,000 members.

Sovereign members often express particular outrage at tax collection, putting Internal Revenue Service employees at risk.

(Reporting By Patrick Temple-West; Editing by Kevin Drawbaugh)
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/02/07/us-usa-fbi-extremists-idUSTRE81600V20120207

Careful what you say guys you might get on the FBI's wanted list.....
Poor Ron Paul he's doomed now......

This is from Reuters not the Onion!
Reality check plse :wtf:
 
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By "sovereign citizen", I'm assuming they mean someone who subscribes to the US Constitution?
 
I couldn't agree more that the world's economic situation is a direct result of the US forcing the world to move away from a physical representation of wealth (gold) to the concept that a government can just print all the money it wants.

The rest however seems rather extremist!
 
Really ?

You do realise that defy government environmental regulations includes growing your own food, eating what you grow and few other things.

I was referring more to the acts of shooting police officials more than defy the environmental regulations. Yes, I realise that a police officer is an arm of the government, but at the end of the day he or she is generally just someone who is trying to make a living.
 
I couldn't agree more that the world's economic situation is a direct result of the US forcing the world to move away from a physical representation of wealth (gold) to the concept that a government can just print all the money it wants.

The rest however seems rather extremist!

Well, the rest of the world are a bunch of pussies if they got "forced", and deserve it. Really, Russia and China where forced? haha. Rather I think most of them just agreed it sounded like a smart move.
 
Well, the rest of the world are a bunch of pussies if they got "forced", and deserve it. Really, Russia and China where forced? haha. Rather I think most of them just agreed it sounded like a smart move.

Poor naive soul doesn't know America is too blame for absolutely everything that is wrong in our world today
 
Why do libertarians resort to violence so quickly?

These anti government people are hectic. Reminds me of that Norwegian killer :eek:
 
Why do libertarians resort to violence so quickly?

These anti government people are hectic. Reminds me of that Norwegian killer :eek:
Don't create separate camps of libertarians and liberals. They're very similar actually. Both want freedom.

Saying that though, the people who think gold standard is better than fractional reserve don't understand economics.
 
Don't create separate camps of libertarians and liberals. They're very similar actually. Both want freedom.

Yeah... but where they are different in ideology is on government size, social spending and taxation. A modern social liberal today has no problem with a well managed accountable government, and has no problem with social spending. Liberals these days prefer include social justice in their freedoms. The libertarians in this forum use similar arguments as these extremists. Like... governments suck (they want no or little government), that taxation is theft and so on...

The camps were seperated ages ago... otherwise the libertarian Norwegian killer would not have felt it necessary to kill modern social liberals in his killing spree.

Im sorry, there is a big enough difference between the ideologies that is directly related to this conversation.
 
America is fast becoming a Police State.... and this is just a normal reaction to it.
These people are just kicking back at each one of their rights being taken away.
 
Saying that though, the people who think gold standard is better than fractional reserve don't understand economics.

I dont think that you have met our libertarian friends from the church of the austrian "school" of economics and their lord savior His Lordship Von Mises have you? :D They recon the gold standard is the bee`s knee`s.
 
Why do libertarians resort to violence so quickly?

These anti government people are hectic. Reminds me of that Norwegian killer :eek:

Same reason leftists do. Like the Greek protesters who threw petrol bombs at police and torched a bank killing 3 people.

America is fast becoming a Police State.... and this is just a normal reaction to it.
These people are just kicking back at each one of their rights being taken away.

Never not in the age of the Obamasiah
 
Never not in the age of the Obamasiah

I know you are being sarcastic, but I was watching this video last night and was shocked to see what is going on over there...
(I know there is not enough information given in each case in the video, or that some of these guys do deserve a beat down, but nevertheless you can make your own mind up)

[video=youtube;XxlL0I5AWLI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxlL0I5AWLI&feature=email&email=comment_reply_received[/video]
[video=youtube;OEoJQpkUNRc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEoJQpkUNRc&feature=related[/video]
 
Don't create separate camps of libertarians and liberals. They're very similar actually. Both want freedom.

2 different types of freedom though:

Liberals want the freedom for government intrusion into the private lives of citizens hidden behind a legislative veneer of the "welfare of the people".
The first steps towards a nanny state

Libertarians want freedom from government intrusion, legislation and walfare. Positive moves away from any form of "state" mentality.
 
Liberals want the freedom for government intrusion into the private lives of citizens hidden behind a legislative veneer of the "welfare of the people".
The first steps towards a nanny state

Yurre, but you talk a load of kaak. lol.
Probably the most epic false dichotomy for today (it included such a sexy straw man... its a ahead of all the others) so far :D
 
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I have never heard of the term "sovereign citizens". It feels like it's a twisted version of a natural person.

There are two "persons" identified in law. These are natural persons and artificial persons. An artificial person is defined as a legal entity, not a human being, recognized as a person in law to whom legal rights and duties may attach. An artificial person may sometimes be referred to as a corporation.

Examples of an artificial person would be; Taxpayer, driver, voter, citizen (ID no. is your artificial person's identity for you need it to enter any legal matter), homeowner, officer, etc. One way to see if someone is referring to the artificial person is by viewing how the person's name is written. If it's all capital letters then it is referring to your artificial person and not the natural person (you).

The natural person well that is the actual human being and only common law affects them.

One way to distinguish what laws apply to one is by searching the meaning of the word person whenever it comes up in law. What one finds is that most laws are not meant for the natural person. Most of these are often to do with licences/registrations of all kinds.

So in other words the FBI is warning the government about the natural person and their non-compliance. The reason being that the natural person is not consenting to the laws that apply to the artificial person. Even though these people have forfeited their artificial person status.

Here is a video of such a person;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uliLfykURYo
 
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Yeah... but where they are different in ideology is on government size, social spending and taxation. A modern social liberal today has no problem with a well managed accountable government, and has no problem with social spending. Liberals these days prefer include social justice in their freedoms. The libertarians in this forum use similar arguments as these extremists. Like... governments suck (they want no or little government), that taxation is theft and so on...
Uhm, your pigeon holes still aren't small enough. :D

I consider myself to be a "modern social liberal" and I want all politicians to die in a fire. There is no place for liberalism or liberty in any society with institutionalised systems of control (i.e. governments and the state) that everyone is subject to without any form of recourse (btw, voting for your masters is not a form of recourse.)
 
2 different types of freedom though:

Liberals want the freedom for government intrusion into the private lives of citizens hidden behind a legislative veneer of the "welfare of the people".
The first steps towards a nanny state

Libertarians want freedom from government intrusion, legislation and walfare. Positive moves away from any form of "state" mentality.

To put it differently:
Some social liberals have the biggest hearts and only want to do good. They want to have "equality" and "social justice" whatever that means to them. And they think the best way to have these bleeding heart ideals is to have a government that implements these ideals or ideologies. Of course there are a few problems with this. Firstly, they never really succeed to properly define "equality" in a manner that is not incoherent and they usually fail to provide a coherent definition for what it means to be good for "social justice" to make any sense. Secondly, they appear to be a little naive in thinking ANY government can properly implement such fuzzy ideals without it turning into a totalitarian and/or fascist state.
 
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