GM Food in S.A.

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pcgig

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Last week wednesday I went into a local Pick n Pay and bought myself the so called healthier brown bread.I only used up a quarter of it and today 1 week later its still fresh.Makes me wonder since the government is refusing to label Gm food maybe this is one of those.Why can't We have a choice to choose for our selves?I mean whether You stand for Genetically modified food or not.I heard that a few months ago zimbabwe rejected GM foods from the west,maybe Mugabe has his head screwed on right this time on this one.
 
It's insidous. Also noticeable in tomatos that never rot. Tasteless red things that just get soft.

A lot of labels have "Modified Starch" on them. That's also GM. This country seems to be a soft touch for the likes of Monsanto.
 
I think Boodles has a link to GM products in his signature. Seems like practically all soya milk that is sold in SA is GM although many claim not to be.
 
How will we ever know for sure?I mean if i'm sure they even have secret farms here for such products.
 
There's nothing to stop modified soya plants from pollinating non-modified ones. I don't care really. People eat different proteins every day...why should it be a problem when one plant's protein is in another?
Bread not going "off" is probably due to a lack of certain carbohydrates which fungi like Rhizopus ("bread mould") use...or maybe just different forms of the carbohydrates. (e.g. when you use "seed bread" vs normal wheat bread) Might just be luck too? Did you keep it in the fridge by any chance?

PS: I know the one prof that did the tests in that link boodles had/has in his sig :p
 
Lol - sig gone from gm foods to brown string. Maybe its the same sh*t anyway.
 
I prefer GM food :p
They are often more tasty, last longer and looks better.
And no they cant pollinate other plants if they are infertile, or atleast that is my understanding of the word.
 
werries2 said:
I prefer GM food :p
They are often more tasty, last longer and looks better.
And no they cant pollinate other plants if they are infertile, or atleast that is my understanding of the word.
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They aren't infertile so they can interbreed with similar species just like the original plant.
 
I have to admit, I'm curious - but then, have never really done extensive research into it. What's the problem with GM products? Why the big fuss? The way people make it sound, one would think it's the equivalent of eating metal. Either way, it doesn't bother me.

Why is there such a big fuss made over it? Why does it matter? Food is food, right? Are there any side-effects? If so, what? If not, why complain? I don't even know if I've ever had anything GM, most of what I eat anyway claims to be non-GM :p
 
Lycanthrope, most of what you eat doesnt claim to be non-GM. There are no regulations in SA regarding this.

I'd like to be given the choice, so i would like to see labelling saying if it contains gm or not. And why wouldnt businesses not label their product as GM?

I'm just a bit worried about the long term with this stuff.
 
Oh no, granted Boodles - I feel the same. I'd like to know for the sake of choice and awareness, but I'm curious about why it's such an issue for a number of people - I don't think I really understand the gravity of it.
 
Praeses said:
They aren't infertile so they can interbreed with similar species just like the original plant.
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As far as I know there is a regulation that GM crops should be infertile, for the exact reasons stated here interbreeding with other plants. Hence one of the biggest problems with these seeds in Africa have been that you can only buy the GM seed, and not replant some of your old crop for the next year.
 
Lycanthrope said:
I have to admit, I'm curious - but then, have never really done extensive research into it. What's the problem with GM products? Why the big fuss? The way people make it sound, one would think it's the equivalent of eating metal. Either way, it doesn't bother me.

Why is there such a big fuss made over it? Why does it matter? Food is food, right? Are there any side-effects? If so, what? If not, why complain? I don't even know if I've ever had anything GM, most of what I eat anyway claims to be non-GM :p
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No long term effects are known...but I wouldn't be amazed if there weren't any. People need to understand what GM foods are. They fear GM foods because they don't know how it works. Most GM plants are insect resistant (Bt) and/or herbicide resistant. Other GM traits aren't that popular yet but are used on occasion. GM involves transferring e.g. a gene from a naturally herbicide resistant plant which codes for herbicide resistance, into a plant e.g. maize. The GM'ed maize will then produce the same protein as the naturally herbicide resistant plant which allows tolerance of herbicides. It's not going to mutate you into a fish more than a normal banana will change you into a fish. ;)

It is however unethical that people don't have a choice whether they eat GM food or not. Personally, I don't care but I understand that some people (especially uninformed/unknowledgeable people) want to have a choice.
The facts are, you've been eating GM foods for many years now and you probably consume some form of GM soy almost every day of your life.(if you eat meat - it's added to prevent discolouration of the meat).
 
werries2 said:
As far as I know there is a regulation that GM crops should be infertile, for the exact reasons stated here interbreeding with other plants. Hence one of the biggest problems with these seeds in Africa have been that you can only buy the GM seed, and not replant some of your old crop for the next year.
Click to expand...

One of the known "patent-problems" is that one farmer's expensive (due to patents) GM crops might fertilize his neighbour's non-GM crops. Should the neighbour then pay a royalty fee since he'll produce partly GM crops? I guess it is possible that infertility is used by some biotech firms to prevent the above situation from happening so some GM plants will be infertile but others won't. I'm sure you can find a definitive answer on google :)
 
Since I'm a vegetarian, everything meat-like which I eat is soy anyway :D I loooove soy... Just keep tofu the hell away from me.

I'm with you on that - I don't care whether it's GM or non-GM, but I imagine that I would prefer GM food over non-GM because no pesticides would be involved, so no harm to the environment because of it. In fact, just from what you said, I imagine there'd be more benefits than problems.

One thing bothers me though, if a plant is made genetically immune to bugs (or however you'd term it), wouldn't those genetics affect us? I mean, if it's poisonous/unappealing to bugs, wouldn't it be the same for us? Perhaps I misunderstand.

So far, I like the advantages.
 
Lycanthrope said:
Since I'm a vegetarian, everything meat-like which I eat is soy anyway :D I loooove soy... Just keep tofu the hell away from me.

I'm with you on that - I don't care whether it's GM or non-GM, but I imagine that I would prefer GM food over non-GM because no pesticides would be involved, so no harm to the environment because of it. In fact, just from what you said, I imagine there'd be more benefits than problems.

One thing bothers me though, if a plant is made genetically immune to bugs (or however you'd term it), wouldn't those genetics affect us? I mean, if it's poisonous/unappealing to bugs, wouldn't it be the same for us? Perhaps I misunderstand.

So far, I like the advantages.
Click to expand...

The toxins are very specific up to the species level of insects
Upon sporulation, B. thuringiensis forms crystals of proteinaceous insecticidal δ-endotoxins (Cry toxins: Bacillus thuringiensis Toxin Nomenclature) which are encoded by cry genes. Cry toxins have specific activities against species of the orders Lepidoptera (Moths and Butterflies), Diptera (Flies and Mosquitoes) and Coleoptera (Beetles). Thus, B. thuringiensis serves as an important reservoir of Cry toxins and cry genes for production of biological insecticides and insect-resistant genetically modified crops.
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wiki
So you'll have one form of the toxin that kills only a specific species of moth (caterpillar) which is common in a specific area or another for another insect.
The only impact that this can directly have on humans is that you might be allergic to the protein which would be scarce. How many people do you know that's allergic to bananas? :rolleyes: If you find out that you're allergic to something, you refrain from eating it. Simple as that...but that means the foods should be labelled GM or not.
 
Hmmm.... Brilliant point. However, personally, I'd prefer to not kill the wittle bugs so much as just make them disinterested in the foods. Plus, wouldn't the bugs eventually gain an aversion/immunity to the new genes?
 
Lycanthrope said:
Hmmm.... Brilliant point. However, personally, I'd prefer to not kill the wittle bugs so much as just make them disinterested in the foods. Plus, wouldn't the bugs eventually gain an aversion/immunity to the new genes?
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Natural selection would drive the insects to gain resistance.
The same is happening with antibiotics...the bacteria are becoming highly resistant to antibiotics...but it took them many years to get there. I believe with insects it would take longer (since they don't transfer their genes directly to all individuals around them and generations take longer).
Killing the bugs is unfortunately an ecological necessity IMO (feel free to differ). Remember, in nature you never would've had huge maize stalks nor hectares of maize flourishing in one area. Human impact is kinda forcing changes in the ecosystems to increase in rate as the more successful species will basically wipe out the lesser successful ones (or ones which don't gain advantages from hectares of maize) by just breeding in extremely high numbers. Humans are such a pest :rolleyes:
 
Agreed :D

So, what did we learn today? :p

I, personally, like the idea of GM foods - but I'm much too ignorant of the facts to know what the long-term repercussions will be. If the bugs die out, that could negatively affect the birds and other animals in the area, but at the same time, I'm sure that a balance would be restored in time and the environment will adapt. In the end, it's a much better solution than poisoning everything in sight with pesticides. At least, that's my opinion.

Thanks for the enlightening posts Praeses :p Your patience with me is always surprising :) And it's appreciated.
 
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