Routers for USB HSDPA modems

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bHOLDher

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Has anyone else been researching the different options with routers and USB HSDPA modems?

The way I see it, there are some options working out of the box, some alternative firmware options, and then some other options.

Out of the box:

I believe it works to buy a PCMCIA to USB card and plug this into a router with a PCMCIA slot (like the good old Linksys WRT54G3G), this is probably relatively expensive.

Routers with USB UMTS support:

Billion 7402GX +-R1500
Dovado UMR (Apparently this should be the cheapest router, but it does not seem to be available in SA yet? Tell me I'm wrong)

Firmware options:

These guys are modifying the ASUS firmware to work with the USB modems: http://koppel.cz/cdmawifi/english/ Its difficult to get prices on the supported ASUS routers, but it seems its going to be similarly priced as the Billion 7402GX, except for one model: The WL320gE/gP apparently does not have an external USB connector, but it can easily be soldered onto the motherboard. I think I found a price +- R800 for this router. It seems as if there could still be some stability issues with this firmware.

Similarly, it seems the OpenWRT firmware also supports dialing up a USB modem with the Kamikaze firmware: http://forum.openwrt.org/viewtopic.php?id=15468
In theory then any router with a USB port that supports OpenWRT should work. (A list of routers = http://wiki.openwrt.org/TableOfHardware)
I started looking at the Linksys WRTSL54GS, but even finding a relative overseas price on this is surprisingly difficult, nevermind prices in SA.
Some other info (it could be tricky): http://forum.x-wrt.org/index.php?topic=508.0

Other Options:

Some Windows mobile device HSDPA phones with Wifi support can be loaded with software to convert it into a "router": http://support.wmwifirouter.com/devices/ This is probably not going to be cheap = understatement.

Also, what would the cheapest neatest smallest PC platform be to load linux on and run it as a standalone router?

There are a lot of options, and I guess the best solution for one person would not be the best for another. Any ideas, suggestions, other options?

After all, how stable is this? My brother's Billion 7402GX does not want to dial up his modem... It worked once for two days.

Why aren't there any PPPoE HSDPA modems? (reasonably priced)
 
It appears that the Koppel/OpenWRT firmware might also function on the Asus WL-520gU which sells in SA for <R500. You could also look at the Asus WL-500g Premium (v1 or v2). I did see them on sale at several of the local online websites a few months ago - look on Jump or Pricewatch. It should also be possible to connect some type of external storage via USB to one of the Asus routers. It might also be compatible with the Neotel 'brick'.
http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies-archive.cfm/880784.html
http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php?t=128151
Zapp, a CDMA network operator in Romania appears to be offering this Asus router with their CDMA devices.
http://www.zapp.ro/en/internet-data/terminals/asus-wifi-router/

You could also look at some of these devices ...
http://www.sybaritic.co.za/store/product_info.php?products_id=15217- (not sure whether this is a standalone 3G router).
http://www.bidorbuy.co.za/item/8662688/HSDPA_Wireless_Router_with_3G_PC_Card_Slot.html
Draytek Vigor 2820/2910 (www.draytek.co.za)
http://www.bidorbuy.co.za/item/8759278/Draytek_Vigor_2910_3G_Router.html
 
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Great, thanks for the info!

The ASUS routers seem like very good value for money. Its seems there are still some issues with the chipset in the WL-520gU and WL-500gP v2 running USB2.0. I think the Koppel firmware is temporarily removed again until they figure it out. http://www.realtech.co.za/realwiki.php?title=Asus_Routers
It seems everyone is working on a solution though, and it seems like some people managed to get it running on other firmware. Interesting... I must investigate further.

Oh, the link for the WL-500gP (not sure which version), its tricky to find: http://online.phetla.com/product_info.php?products_id=692 comx's website says that its not sold anymore:confused:
 
In Asia and the US Asus routers are very cheap - the WL-520gU sells for <R270 and the WL-500gP v.2 <R480 in single unit quantities. Cancel the Chinese download and click on the moving router icon ...
http://www.jumbo-computer.com/pricelist.asp?ProductTypeCode=WIR

This company also appears to sell the Asus WL-500gP reflashed with Koppel firmware ...
http://www.siptune.com/siptune.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=38_46&products_id=156
Eurotel in the Czech Republic another CDMA operator also distributes the WL-500gP with new firmware ...
http://www.cz.o2.com/osobni/en/telefony_a_zarizeni/modemy_a_data/detail.html?phoneId=451

If you do have some success with reflashing any of the Asus routers I'm sure that this will be of interest to many others. There also seems to be a considerable demand for a cheap router for the Neotel device.
 
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I think Linksys are working on a new version of WRT54G3G, with support for the USB HSDPA modems. Can't find any info yet.
 
bHOLDher said:
There are a lot of options, and I guess the best solution for one person would not be the best for another. Any ideas, suggestions, other options?

After all, how stable is this? My brother's Billion 7402GX does not want to dial up his modem... It worked once for two days.
Click to expand...

Noted in some other threads - I recently got the Billion 7300GX for PCMCIA Data Cards and have not had a days problem - I think the R1500 I spent on it was worth every penny!
 
MainMeat, are you using it with a USB PCMCIA Card and USB modem? Cause I'm on a USB mission.:)

Yotch, you had me going on the reflashed routers. That is the version 1 router (antenna on the left as viewed from the front/LED side of the router) , which seems to have less issues with the new firmware (its a different version of the Koppel firmware as well, since it has a different CPU).

I would really want to get the WL-500gP V2 since it has the same CPU as the WL-520gU, BUT the gP has 8MB flash where the gU only has 4MB. I figured if I can get it running on the gP and the firmware takes less than 4MB, then it will work on the el-cheapo gU too.

Sadly no one seems to be able to get the WL-500gP V2 in SA (yet).

Phetla sent me a picture of theirs. Its a WL-500g Premium (aka version 1) which is sold reflashed in the links you posted. So that should work no problem.

Now I'm kinda stuck, should I buy the WL-520gU, which is quite widely available, and hope that 4MB is going to be enough? I will probably do that after a little more investigation.
 
@bHOLDher: That's quite a good price that you posted in your link for the WL-500gP v.1 - at least in SA. This might be the cheapest most reliable option at the moment if there are still problems with the 520gU. Asus would surely increase sales of both the WL520gU and the WL500gP v.2 if the Koppel software problems could be resolved. I wonder if they are planning to keep on manufacturing the v.1 if the v.2 does not prove to be a suitable replacement. Linksys resurrected the Linux version of the WRT54G to satisfy the demand from some customers.

Let us know if you have any success with getting any of the Asus models to work reliably.

Here are some links to small single board Linux computers that might also be of interest.
http://www.deviceguru.com/2008/08/06/tiny-6-chip-open-computer-runs-linux/
 
Just a quick update:

I got an Asus WL-520gU last week, loaded Koppel, which connects my E220 modem without issues, but, the USB issue is very much an issue. As soon as I try to send a couple of large packets, the router hangs. The guys on the Koppel forum says the 520gU is not supported yet.:confused: I would like to know if the 500gP V2 is working or not... (but it's somewhat irrelevant since its not available here)

My next mission is to try and get DD-WRT to dial up the modem. This is going to be a bit more complicated.

This week, at work, I have fallen trap to the dark side of source:p so it might take a while until I have some more news on this - sadly.

That single board linux computer is really nifty!
 
No good news, but no bad news

OK, this is quite an *interesting* project. :)

There are one or two patches in openwrt for the WL-500gP v2 and WL-520gU.

In the DD-WRT forums, there is one thread for getting USB support (Flash disks / Ext HDD / web cameras) running stable on the 520gU. This was where I started. It is named "dd-wrt.v24-101037_NEWD_mini_usb.bin". It IS stable, copying data off a flash disk without any issues at +- 1MB/second.

BUT, the usb-serial drivers are not loaded, which is required for modems. I'm not entirely sure why, but it does not seem possible to load all the updates on this version of DD-WRT. Without the driver I cannot test if the modem would be stable.

Then I found a DD-WRT forum thread where the usb-serial drivers are included in the firmware. Its odd - I'm battling to remember what went wrong here - I think I was unable to install the modem connection packages and scripts to dial up the modem with PPP. Yes, I could communicate with the modem with AT commands, but I could not get it to connect. Maybe I should try this once more.

Then I tried OpenWRT, a Kamikaze build for a WL-500gP V2. At first it would not flash, but using the ASUS flash recovery tool I managed to get it running. This is a bit of a mission as there is no web interface on this firmware, so everything you setup, you have to setup in the linux command prompt. After a bit of effort I managed to get my Motorola V300 phone to connect, and then, sadly, hang my router again. I do not think the 520gU USB patches are applied to this firmware though.

At this point, I needed to prove to myself that I can get the Huawei E220 to connect as well. I battled with this, until I realized that the usb storage drivers must not be installed. The usb storage drivers take over the modem's virtual CD-ROM and then it will not let go. After un-installing the usb storage drivers it was quite easy to get the E220 to connect, and then hang my router as well.

By the way, the guys write a script, if I understand correctly, that installs the usb storage drivers when any USB device OTHER than an E220 (or similar) is plugged in. In this way the modem works fine while the firmware still supports flash disks.

The sad thing is, I still cannot prove whether this is going to work or not.

Options still on my todo list:

1. Try the "dd-wrt.v24_mini_usb_generic.bin" firmware again in case I missed something.

2. Learn how to compile my own firmware, and compile a DD-WRT version with all the 520gU patches, and all the necessary packages installed.

3. Compile an OpenWRT firmware based on the newest kernel version 2.6, versus the widely used version 2.4.
Apparently version 2.6 does not support wireless on this router (and many others), or the experimental support that you can get is not always reliable.
But, it seems to support USB functionality on the 520gU perfectly. So, going this route might create a wired router, sadly still without a web interface.

4. Compile an OpenWRT 2.4 firmware with all the 520gU pathes applied to see if the router stops hanging if it connects.

So I really want to get DD-WRT working since it is easy to setup with the web interface.

I would also really want to know what DD-WRT's issue is with installing new packages, I understand that the fact that its not an official release has something to do with it.

Oh, another thing about me being worried that the router does not have enough flash disk space - in theory it should be possible to plug in a flash disk and install other packages on the flash disk, or even boot the router completely off the flash disk. :cool:
 
While its probably been interesting for a hobbyist point of view, you would have saved a lot of time & effort by going with the Billion.

Yes 7402GX is more expensive but from fw 5.53.s3.ds3 its been very stable with the E220. See that 5.53.s4 has just been released and supposedly should be good with the E272 (still need to test).

bHOLDher said:
Why aren't there any PPPoE HSDPA modems? (reasonably priced)
Click to expand...
Never will be, as GSM/UMTS networks do not natively use the PPP protocol for access session management (unlike most DSL, iBurst & WiMax implementations). Cellular networks evolved from a voice, not data mindset.
 
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Hehehe, yup, I was thinking the same thing.

However, my brother's 7402GX is still not connecting with his Novatel MC 950 D modem. In the meantime he is borrowing an E220 while they are trying to make the Novatel work. It was also quite a bit of time and effort to prove that it was not working.

Strangely, the evening that I visited my brother we could not even get my E220 to connect, but, in hindsight, I don't think we gave the router a power cycle reboot.

This is why I am trying to find another solution. Preferably with a WRT based firmware.

Obviously I do not really need this to work any time soon, otherwise I would have definitely gone out and bought something that works off the shelf.

And based on the hardware available in SA, I would like to share my progress on this project in case anyone else wanted to try it. :)
 
bHOLDher said:
Strangely, the evening that I visited my brother we could not even get my E220 to connect, but, in hindsight, I don't think we gave the router a power cycle reboot.
Click to expand...
Maybe pm BILLION Tech to get the latest firmware, the 1st few images were a bit dodge on the USB.
 
@bHOLDher: Thanks for the update. I'm sure that this project will attract considerable interest if you manage to get your E220 to work reliably with the WL-520gU since this router is much cheaper than any of the other 3G USB routers on the market.

What exactly is the difference between the WL-500gP v.2 and the WL-520gU - is it just the amount of RAM and Flash memory? If you doubled the size of the RAM and Flash memory chips and updated the firmware would this convert the 520gU into a 500gP v.2? Is the 500gP v.2 now working correctly?

Here are some photographs of the insides of the WL-500gP v.2.
http://forum.openwrt.org/viewtopic.php?id=14856
This information about upgrading the Ram on Asus routers might also be of interest.
http://wl500g.info/archive/index.php/t-12962.html
 
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@Roman4604:
Billion emailed the latest unreleased firmware to my brother (probably a month ago now), and that still did not get his Novatel going, but I am convinced this will be sorted out soon. Billion listed the Novatel MC 950 D modem on their global website, so they have to get it working, if it's not working now, then it soon will be.

@Yotch:
Thanks for the links.
If you compare the WL-500gP v2 photo with the 520gU (http://techgage.com/article/asus_wl-520gu_wireless_router/2) you can see that the boards are very similar, but, the 500gP also has 2 USB ports where the 520gU only has one. The firmware does detect 2 USB ports/hubs on the 520gU because the most of the hardware is basically built into the chipset (CPU, ethernet hub, WiFi and USB) which brings the price down.

The way I understand it's basically just the RAM and flash chip thats not on the chipset. For this reason I am still convinced that everything should work the same on both the 500gPv2 and 520gU, but only time will tell.

Is the 500gP v.2 now working correctly?
Click to expand...
It is surprisingly difficult to find proof of it either working or not. I honestly don't know yet. :)

I don't have much news for this week sadly. I managed to get DD-WRT to communicate with my Moto V300 (AT commands, returning signal strength etc), but now I cannot get PPP to connect. pppd crashes with a result code 2, which *could* mean insufficient memory.. but ppp works fine on OpenWRT. Hmmmm...

Never a dull moment :D
 
@bHOLDher: I did also find that photo of the inside of the 520gU. If the BCM5354 chip is exactly the same as the BCM5354 on the 500gP v.2 then the only difference it would appear (apart from the Flash/Ram etc.) would be the built-in hub. The hub chip appears to be an SMSC USB2502 - other links refer to it as an SMSC USB2520 but I can only find a USB2502 which fits the description.
SMSC USB 2502 datasheet
http://www.smsc.com/main/datasheets/2502db.pdf
Schematic for a two port USB2502 hub
http://www.smsc.com/main/anpdf/an119.pdf
List of SMSC USB hub datasheets - also look at the USB2504
http://www.smsc.com/main/datasheet.html

You can actually purchase this chip as well as the hub evaluation board from either Mouser or Digikey in the US or you might be able to ask SMSC to send you a free sample - http://www.mouserelectronics.com/catalog/635/301.pdf
The chip sells for around 5USD and the evaluation board for the ridiculous amount of 100USD! Alternatively you could try to borrow an SMSC based hub for testing purposes. I have only been able to find one local hub product that appears to use an SMSC chip i.e. the Belkin F5U234V1 but you might be able to find something cheaper locally using Google (Targus? IOGear?) or you could ask SMSC to suggest a supplier. Some of the hubs that are available at the moment have transparent cases so you can see the chip supplier at a glance. If you can't arrange an SMSC based hub it might still be worthwhile to test the E220 with the 520gU running Koppel firmware via a good quality externally powered hub. The problems that you have been experiencing could be power supply related or the result of slight synchronisation errors.

More pics of the WL-500gP v.2 showing the USB hub chip ...
https://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/oet/forms/blobs/retrieve.cgi?attachment_id=791558&native_or_pdf=pdf
 
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@Shawn: Many thanks for the link and for taking the time to update us on your progress to date.

I was going to suggest that you might be interested in taking a look at somebody's attempts to add a serial port to the 520gU until I realised that you were the original source of the information!

My interest in the 520gU was to use it as a cost effective 3G/HSDPA/CDMA router but I am still waiting to see whether or not the USB problems can be resolved. After looking at the link that you provided I still think that it might be possible to get a working solution using the Koppel firmware together with a suitable hub since the firmware appears to now work reliably on the 500v2 but I haven't tested this myself. Several people have already tried to do this unsuccessfully though. This could be due to the hub controller and from what I can see the Belkin F5U234 V1 (SMSC USB2504) would presumably be the best choice. Do you know what type of hub sbrown has been using? Most of the cheap Chinese hubs are based on the Genesys GL850A chip which might cause problems. There is a discussion about attempts to use hubs with the 520gU over at the Koppel forum (if you haven't already seen it!) ...
http://koppel.cz/conferences/viewtopic.php?t=1939&sid=ebe52a13460496ff2a8e72845efcdb0f
I have also been keeping an eye on one or two threads such as this over at Whirlpool ...
http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies-archive.cfm/880784.html

Hopefully bHOLDher has been making progress ...

Let us know if you do manage to resolve what appears to be a very frustrating problem!
 
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no news

Shawn, thanks for the link, I caught that conversation a while back, and until I read it, I was convinced that the 520gU can do anything the 500gPv2 can do. I seem to be wrong on that. :)

Yotch, you nearly got me excited with the whirlpool link - I re loaded koppel, and used "Dial Up" instead of the pre configured CDMA - E220 settings, (of course it connected NO problem) and I managed to stay online for at least a minute :p. This also feels very much like a memory leak problem, as "Dial up" seems to fix the 500gPv2 (if I understand correctly)(which has double the RAM) and only improves the 520gU.

Sadly I havn't made much progress lately. I battled to get PPP connecting on DD-WRT. It seems the way additional programs are installed into /jffs/ does not suit pppd. And then at one stage I felt like I was getting really close to make a ppp connection, and the router stopped responding. (It could have been connected - not sure)

At this point I gave up and tried to get linux running so I can try to compile OpenWRT running on the latest 2.6 kernel, since people seem to have more joy, apart from the fact that the router's WiFi adapter must then be disabled. It could have helped if someone posted this firmware online for the 520gU.

Someone posted step by step instructions to get Debian running in windows to compile the firmware.... Ehhhh... it doesnt work that way - this turns out to be a mission too :D

Ive got a bit of a debugging overdose from trying to get ready for a new release at work, so this project is currently on a go slow.
 
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