AB de villiers

[ZCFOutkast]

I put more stock in the ICC's opinion of AB than yours.

I wasn't talking about a selection of the best players over a specific period. I was talking about a Test XI I could select and it would be able to beat selections of one of the Tests teams (e.g AUS the only other side capable of assembling a competitive side minus those in the World XI).

Even you in your right mind would know Williamson, Root, Broad, Herath, Southee would not make it into the best Test XI side now, yet Root&Williamson have been as prolific as AB in run scoring Tests wise but I left them out of my side too.

Comments below you have shown Amla is basically the first pick in Tests&ODIs ahead of everyone else as you can trust him to bat anywhere in the top 4 successfully. In my opinion (and most if you follow most cricket forums through the world) this ICC selection is a joke practically, but over a period it fits the bill.

Australia can easily beat this ICC Test team - (Rogers, Watson, Shaun Marsh, Smith, Clarke(c), Mitchell Marsh, Haddin(wk), Harris, Starc, Lyon, Hazlewood). Even an alternative Test XI selection stands a good chance of beating it - (Amla, Younis/Shehzad/Ballance, Kohli/KP, Smith, Clarke(c), Watson, BMac(wk), Philander, Harris, Ajmal, Anderson/Roach) beacuse it's more balanced. I don't think any Test selection can beat my XI because those are the best right now (minus Chanders, Clarke&AB whose batting can be matched but they bring nothing else, and none are anywhere near as good as Sanga).

That ICC side has 5 tailenders(4 seamers&a spinner), an unnatural opener who's young&still developing, AB who has no significant experience coming in at #4, Joe Root who like Williamson is young&still developing. Johnson batting at #7!!! Of the top 7, the only players fit for their roles are Warner, Sanga&Mathews.

Mathews is a brilliant captain make no mistak, fantastic, but he can't hold candle to Clarke.

That team would lose to AUS and an alternative selection but you're welcome to stand by the ICC.

I won't even bother with that ICC ODI side because NZ, AUS, SA, ENG, IND, SL and maybe even PAK would thump that ICC ODI side 10 matches out of 10, never mind 3 alternative ODI selections one cuold come up with!

At the end of the day, given a chance, I doubt if those in the selction panel - Kumble, Jonathan Angew, Russel Arnold, Stephen Fleming and Betty Timmer - would have individually selected any XI that looks close to those.

Yes AB can be accomodated but in an manner that is unnatural to him and he's entirely unproven at, something I wouldn't waste time doing considering I'm given tens of these brilliant suited players to pick an XI from. He's had a brilliant Test year in 2013, but on the whole he has been inferior to the really top batsmen for all the other years/seasons. You have to go back to 2008 to get his next best year. Not good enough when compared to the very best performers in each of the last 10 years. He doesn't even feature in this list while a lot of current players do http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/records/284248.html. Never mind this list http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/records/142011.html

 

[ZCFOutkast]

Nah I'd say Viv Richards. But definitely the best ODI opener for me...

Amla is more your Sachin, Bevan&Mike Hussey type of player. Classy dependable accumulators.

That's not why ODIs were introduced. It was more for players like Viv Richards, Hayden, Sehwag, Lara, Ponting&AB the type that pulled crowds sentiment aside for the excitement.

But at the end of the day stats don't lie and Amla will rightly be the best.

EDIT: One of the reasons why T20s have now been inroduced is partly because even the likes of Trott&Misbah were/are top 10 batsmen in ODIs. Little difference between Tests&ODIs as a result.

The really fearless and aggressive batsmen Gayle, Maxwell, Hales, Finch, Stokes, BMac, Raina, Afridi etc being what you want to see in T20s.

 

[Rubberpigg]

On BBC radio last night Michael Vaughan, Jason Gillespie and Ashley Giles were choosing their greatest ever ODI teams.
Vaughan said that in 20-30 years time we will be talking about AB de Villiers in the same breath as the greats such as Viv Richards, Brian Lara etc.

Download podcast here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/5lspecials

 

[sand_man]

On BBC radio last night Michael Vaughan, Jason Gillespie and Ashley Giles were choosing their greatest ever ODI teams.
Vaughan said that in 20-30 years time we will be talking about AB de Villiers in the same breath as the greats such as Viv Richards, Brian Lara etc.

Download podcast here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/5lspecials

Meh, what do they know?!

 

[ZCFOutkast]

On BBC radio last night Michael Vaughan, Jason Gillespie and Ashley Giles were choosing their greatest ever ODI teams.
Vaughan said that in 20-30 years time we will be talking about AB de Villiers in the same breath as the greats such as Viv Richards, Brian Lara etc.

Download podcast here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/5lspecials

Some years ago the ICC made a seleciton and these were the players that were selected by them and fans. http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/current/story/482936.html

The World XI: Jack Hobbs, Len Hutton, Don Bradman, Sachin Tendulkar, Viv Richards, Garry Sobers, Adam Gilchrist, Malcolm Marshall, Shane Warne, Wasim Akram, Dennis Lillee

The Second XI: Sunil Gavaskar, Barry Richards, George Headley, Brian Lara, Wally Hammond, Imran Khan, Alan Knott, Bill O'Reilly, Fred Trueman, Muttiah Muralitharan, SF Barnes

Readers' XI: Sunil Gavaskar, Virender Sehwag, Don Bradman, Sachin Tendulkar, Brian Lara, Garry Sobers, Adam Gilchrist, Shane Warne, Wasim Akram, Muttiah Muralitharan, Glenn McGrath

Ponting, Sanga, Kallis are not even in it yet you somehow expect AB to in future ones?

Personally I couldn't be bothered about a lot of things because a year or two is a short period of time and players like Root, Kohli, Williamson, Steve Smith etc are already comparable or doing better than AB.

In fact don't see how in the end Smith&Kohli will be regaded as less batsmen than AB, yet I'd punch anyone who suggests those two are anywhere near as good an Ponting/Sanga.

To be fair I think Lara&ViV would feel rather insulted that AB - without a single dominant season - is spoken of in the same breadth as them.

In fact in among modern SA batsmen we have only two who can really say they deserve to be argued among the best ever in a particular format - Amla(ODIs) and Kallis(Tests). Among bowlers on Steyn. Period!

I say it all the time AB bats in an area (lower middle order) where it's hard to standout, unless your numbers are extremely impressive over a long period of time.

On batting alone one would argue AB is not even as good as KP. We overate AB way way too much, but we must never confuse the value of being able to field better than most, keep wicket and bat in an unorthodox exctiting fashion, with the act of actually batting to the level of greats - which is what I think people are guilty of. In the process I think we are sidelining two batsmen who we can really put forward in global discussions Smith (Opener&captain), Amla (greatest at first drop).

Obviously I'm speaking about Test because ODIs in their might from be dead with this decade - and we'll be watching two innings of 20/25 overs instead.

 

[Rubberpigg]

To be fair I think Lara&ViV would feel rather insulted that AB - without a single dominant season - is spoken of in the same breadth as them.

Will be spoken of in the same breath in the future.

Viv Richards: AB de Villiers reminds me of me

The ICC Cricket World Cup 2015 will be a competitive and intriguing tournament, showcasing the world’s best cricketing talent in Australia and New Zealand. The fans will get to enjoy a wide range of batting and bowling styles.

In no particular order then, these are my players to watch out for in this coming tournament.
I have to begin with AB De Villiers, who has just rewritten the record books with the fastest ODI century.
The more I watch him, the more it feels like I am watching myself bat.
He looks very comfortable at the crease.
I like his style and he is one player who is very hard to leave out of any ODI team.

http://gulfnews.com/sport/cricket/world-cup/viv-richards-ab-de-villiers-reminds-me-of-me-1.1451646

 

[Bighit]

Please be patient, ZCF typing out paragraphs again.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

Will be spoken of in the same breath in the future.

I'm familiar with what he said and he basically said what I said myself

I like his style and he is one player who is very hard to leave out of any ODI team.

I never debated his definite presence in any ODI side. You're talking ODIs and along with Kohli, Amla, Viv & Sachin, AB will be the top 5 ODI batsmen ever so no one doubts they belong in the same mention. As for Test, forget it!

A lot of the things said in that article are revealing and they merely add weight to the argument that there's lots of potential that will push AB further down the ladder of batting greats:

KOHLI

The other batsman I am looking forward to seeing in the coming weeks is Virat Kohli. At such a young age he has twice the number of ODI centuries than in Tests and he is such a confident player in limited-overs. It is not to say he isn’t so in the longer format, but I really like his aggressive style in ODI cricket. Look at the way he started his career, and the batsman he has become today. He is simply magnificent in whatever little time he has played so far. He is only going to get better and better and add to his list of achievements.

STEVE SMITH

Among one of the top batsmen in the world today is Steve Smith. He is not the most orthodox player, yet in the last couple years he has improved by leaps and bounds, unlike anyone else recently. Just look at his record after becoming Australia’s Test captain this past summer. He is almost tireless, picks gaps with ease and has a wonderful hand-eye coordination.

KUMAR SANGAKKARA

Kumar Sangakkara will also be playing in his last ICC Cricket World Cup. Over the last few years, no other batsman has lit up the international cricketing scene the way he has. He has scored heavily in both Tests as well as limited-overs.

It says a lot that, even in a CWC ODI article, where Sanga is concerned Viv remembers Tests. It's not an accident that he didn't mention Tests with AB - he explicitly says AB is hard to leave out of any ODI side, but says Sanga has been peerless and also touches on his impact in both ODIs AND TESTS. If you read between the lines, he shares my sentiments. AB is a lesser force than many greats in Tests.

What he says about Kohli - 5 years younger than AB - proves it would be rather silly to equate them at the end of their careers considering Kohli is way ahead of ABdV at every stage of their careers - captaincy, averages, ODI tons, Test tons etc.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

Please be patient, ZCF typing out paragraphs again.

No I was chatting to some Nats over at the dark side.

 

[Neoprod]

Keep going, you almost have me convinced. I'm drafting the letter to Fikile Mbalula as we speak to ask him how this AB guy made it into the SA side and to ask him to put feelers out to KP about coming back for the Proteas.

 

[Noob-Noob]

Keep going, you almost have me convinced. I'm drafting the letter to Fikile Mbalula as we speak to ask him how this AB guy made it into the SA side and to ask him to put feelers out to KP about coming back for the Proteas.

Edit,
Does anyone still read ZCF's books?, I tend to TL;DR all of them.

 

[iDOL]

Edit,
Does anyone still read ZCF's books?, I tend to TL;DR all of them.

Only if someone quotes any part of the post. For the most part on ignore so all posts are blocked from view.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

If you guys paid attention to other forums you would see that AB is analysed and judged fairly, minus sentiment - the kind that clouds a lot of people's judgement about his true quality and status in world cricket.
Have a lok at Pakpassion or even cricketweb where you'll find rate KP ahead of him. All of this was taking place before the rise of Smith, Williamson, Mathews etc.

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/archive/index.php/t-203395.html

Dagger 30th May 2014, 18:10 Suresh Raina - The Best T20 Player In The World

Hands down the MVP of the last 7 seasons of IPL combined.

Never flustered, innovative, unassuming, athletic and consistent. Plus incredibly great to watch.

Easily rate him above even ABD for consistency.


Most Matches
Most Runs
Most Fifties
Most Man of the Matches
Most Catches

Dagger 30th May 2014, 21:23
More fifties, centuries and higher average than AB in T20Is.

More runs, fifties, centuries and higher average than AB in IPL.

More runs, fifties, centuries and higher average than AB in all domestic T20 cricket combined.

Kohli is ahead of him only in T20I's and will remain so, not only because he is a better player overall but also because of his position.

GreenKnightRises 30th May 2014, 21:25
Funny Thread

battler 30th May 2014, 21:42
What's so funny? He is the best ipl player ever and one of the best t20 international players in the world.

GreenKnightRises 31st May 2014, 14:02
I am afraid AB should be feeling jealous over this Special Talented one. Sorry AB, but the Truth is stranger than fiction

Dagger; 31st May 2014 at 14:37
This is a copy paste of my previous post, which you would have come across if you had actually gone through the thread instead of rambling:

More fifties, centuries and higher average than AB in T20Is.

More runs, fifties, centuries and higher average than AB in IPL.

More runs, fifties, centuries and higher average than AB in all domestic T20 cricket combined.

7 years is a sample size that is more than adequate, and remember I'm only talking T20's here.

When I said 'Best T20 Player', I was taking into account all that an ideal T20 cricketer must possess. Raina is a world-class fielder, destructive and innovative batsman, consistent, humble and a handy part time bowling option. If this isn't MVP material I don't know what is.

The fact is if the IPL didn't exist Raina would probably be a very sought after 'mercenary' much like many WI and Aussie players. His performance last night compelled me to put this thread up as a 'corrective' of sorts since he is so underrated.

Raina is a dot on the horizon when compared to AB in Test cricket, and I really didn't feel like I needed to spell that out, but there you go.

battler 31st May 2014, 14:42
Don't let facts come in the way of blind haters

Mamoon 31st May 2014, 15:26
de Villiers is the flavor of the month here, don't take it to heart. People call him the best T20 batsman based on his skill-set only, even though he has not delivered much in South African colors. Even in ODIs, has so far proved to be a big game bottler. That doesn't change the fact that's a brilliant batsman and far superior to Raina overall but some people are simple incapable of drawing a line across formats.

No matter what way you look at it, Raina is a better T20 batsman than de Villiers but for someone reason, this fact will not penetrate the heads of many who'd bring in ODIs and Test performances to prove that de Villiers is a far superior batsman.

It is called stating the obvious when its completely irrelevant.


battler 31st May 2014, 15:31
Yup spot on.
Some will say even dhoni is a better t20 batsmen than raina based on his odi exploits although we know what a joke of a batsman dhoni is in t20's.

Dagger 31st May 2014, 16:26
Exactly right. I don't think there is even the inkling of a debate over whether Raina is a better BATSMAN than AB overall.

AB outclasses him comfortably but Raina has proven again and again that he is the better player in T20 cricket.

Funny how AB's IPL performances are used as evidence of his brilliance in T20's but Raina's IPL performances are used against him 'because it's the IPL'.

GreenKnightRises 31st May 2014, 21:22
Sorry. I couldn't get the courage to go through ur posts after reading the OP .

A few misleading stats taken from a T20 League won't hide the overall fact that how mediocre this leg side slogger is outside this league.

And how many other T20 leagues has Mr. Consistent played??

The fact is that if IPL and Chennai Super Kings had never existed, this guy would have been still playing gully cricket with the street kids.

To some in T20s he's not even as good as Raina, and stats prove it! I think I'm the GreenKnightRises equivalent of MyBB over there

I like this quote elsewhere, and I think at the end of the day that's what th etrue opinion of AB's worth will be.

KP. Easily. 1 good year doesn't make you a better player than a guy that's averaged 50 for almost his entire Test career. Pietersen's played a 5th of his Tests against the best side in the world, going up against Warne and McGrath and he averaged 50 against them in both series. AB's a very talented batsman, but better than Pietersen? Definitely not. AB De Villiers vs Michael Clarke would be a far better comparison.

 

[Neoprod]

Edit,
Does anyone still read ZCF's books?, I tend to TL;DR all of them.

He's entertaining...helps to pass the time waiting for stuff to happen at work. At this point I'm not sure if I'm trolling him or he's trolling everyone.

 

[Mike Hoxbig]

If you guys paid attention to other forums you would see that AB is analysed and judged fairly, minus sentiment - the kind that clouds a lot of people's judgement about his true quality and status in world cricket.
Have a lok at Pakpassion or even cricketweb where you'll find rate KP ahead of him. All of this was taking place before the rise of Smith, Williamson, Mathews etc.

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/archive/index.php/t-203395.html
To some in T20s he's not even as good as Raina, and stats prove it! I think I'm the GreenKnightRises equivalent of MyBB over there

I like this quote elsewhere, and I think at the end of the day that's what th etrue opinion of AB's worth will be.

That forum looks like a joke. Just saw a thread called "How will you be trolling after Ind-Pak match on 15th" and decided that I just wasted a click that I'll never get back. I can see why you'd like it though...

 

[MickeyD]

If you guys paid attention to other forums you would see that AB is analysed and judged fairly, minus sentiment - the kind that clouds a lot of people's judgement about his true quality and status in world cricket.
Have a lok at Pakpassion or even cricketweb where you'll find rate KP ahead of him. All of this was taking place before the rise of Smith, Williamson, Mathews etc.

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/archive/index.php/t-203395.html
To some in T20s he's not even as good as Raina, and stats prove it! I think I'm the GreenKnightRises equivalent of MyBB over there

I like this quote elsewhere, and I think at the end of the day that's what th etrue opinion of AB's worth will be.

8 months old.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

8 months old.

Blessed is the man who, having nothing to say, abstains from giving us wordy evidence of the fact. -George Eliot (1819-1880)

Apt?

 

[MickeyD]

Blessed is the man who, having nothing to say, abstains from giving us wordy evidence of the fact. -George Eliot (1819-1880)

Apt?

It's all that was needed.

What has happened or changed in those 8 months?

 

[ZCFOutkast]

It's all that was needed.

What has happened or changed in those 8 months?

For starters, AB last played a T20 in March 2014, over 10 months ago.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

At this point I'm not sure if I'm trolling him or he's trolling everyone.

Come on ... say it... you always troll me. Mbalula comments aside, even you wouldn't select those ICC squads yourself.