Manual vs Automatic

[SauRoNZA]

Drove both a manual and an automatic. Preferred the manual by far .......
Went with a friend who was in the market for one. In the end he went with the manual version.

Isn't that the one where the manual blips the throttle for you on down shifts?

Not all that manual then is it?

 

[asshat99]

I can easily do without all the manual work required for a manual.

Face it, best auto's are better than the best manuals (and their drivers).

Wait till you see the lap time comparisons of manual versus pdk. Where does all the expert (and these are expert drivers) control and engagement go? Based the number of shifts and the time to do just the shift, there should theoretically only be a couple of seconds lost due to lost acceleration by the slow manual shifts. Meanwhile, the difference between pdk and manual for a Carrera S on the Nurburgring is more than 8 seconds!

Seems even the pros are worse than a computer! Am sure this 70 year old in an old double cab could do better though. Especially if there is a slight slope involved.

 

[Splinter]

Heh he! Of course not, a fellow traveller in the bundus deserves help regardless of what he drives, from a BMX to a BMW! (tongue in cheek comment) Just a bit of bait to see what the reaction would be.

Ja right.

 

[asshat99]

So this guy tested a m3 manual and DCT (funny, now DCT is an auto again) and he still thinks they can't down shift.

I smell BS.

 

[Geoff.D]

Isn't that the one where the manual blips the throttle for you on down shifts?

Not all that manual then is it?

No, the one I drove was a 6-speed manual. If it did have a blip function then I missed it, which is possible. Report on myBB somewhere might have been one of those, will have to look it up.
Makes no difference, I preferred the manual version to the automatic.

 

[SykomantiS]

Clutch pressed in all the way won’t add any wear.

It’s the slipping of clutch that is a problem.

Thrust bearing says Hi
The reason for my clutch replacement 2 months ago was the thrust bearing that failed, not the clutch or flywheel- this in a car that is notorious for eating it's clutch.

I have a manual (Civic, diesel), my fiance drives an auto (Q5, diesel). In any given month I'd say I get more or less a 60/40 split in driving time between the two, spending more time in my own car. As much of a convenience as it is, I'm still not 100% sold on an auto. There are times when I get irritated by the shift logic on the Audi. Not so on any manual.

Having said that- my next car (not that I can afford anything, let alone a fancy automatic) will probably an auto.

 

[SauRoNZA]

Thrust bearing says Hi
The reason for my clutch replacement 2 months ago was the thrust bearing that failed, not the clutch or flywheel- this in a car that is notorious for eating it's clutch.

I have a manual (Civic, diesel), my fiance drives an auto (Q5, diesel). In any given month I'd say I get more or less a 60/40 split in driving time between the two, spending more time in my own car. As much of a convenience as it is, I'm still not 100% sold on an auto. There are times when I get irritated by the shift logic on the Audi. Not so on any manual.

Having said that- my next car (not that I can afford anything, let alone a fancy automatic) will probably an auto.

I guess.

It still takes most of the strain through the process of being released though, not after having been released and remaining so.

But I’m no mechanic.

Isn’t it also called a release bearing for that very reason?

 

[Splinter]

No, the one I drove was a 6-speed manual. If it did have a blip function then I missed it, which is possible. Report on myBB somewhere might have been one of those, will have to look it up.
Makes no difference, I preferred the manual version to the automatic.

Aaah - I made a mistake - I meant to ask if you had ever driven an automatic from the 21'st century.

 

[SykomantiS]

I guess.

It still takes most of the strain through the process of being released though, not after having been released and remaining so.

But I’m no mechanic.

Isn’t it also called a release bearing for that very reason?

From my understanding, as long as the clutch paddle is pushed all the way in, there is pressure on the thrust/release bearing (not sure which is the more correct term- I think it's the same thing really). But i digress- not a mechanic either.

Also- I have some more questions. What is deemed as "low-power" output? And then- torque converter gearboxes- is it not true that the torque converter multiplies engine torque (some even by 3x) during acceleration/ when it's not in locked-up mode? So how come a torque converter box on a smaller powered car would then be a bad thing? I understand the reasoning as to why an AMT is a bad choice. But then I assume these small cars don't have torque converters? Sounds to me like smaller engine cars need all the help they can get.

Also, somewhere along the line Acura decided the world needs double-clutch torque-converter gearboxes. That sounds like something I want in my Honda.

 

[SauRoNZA]

I believe lower powered (rather lower torque) cars can’t actually use a torque converter efficiently because of the significant losses when using it.

It’s why CVT gearboxes became popular as they don’t suffer the same problem and are more equally matched to lower torque engines.

DCT of course is no more of a problem than any manual to mate to an engine, but is a more expensive solution.

 

[Splinter]

No, the one I drove was a 6-speed manual. If it did have a blip function then I missed it, which is possible. Report on myBB somewhere might have been one of those, will have to look it up.
Makes no difference, I preferred the manual version to the automatic.

Ok, so if you only drove the manual, how can you prefer it to the auto which you never drove?

 

[Geoff.D]

Aaah - I made a mistake - I meant to ask if you had ever driven an automatic from the 21'st century.

And if you read my reply properly you would have seen I drove an automatic also. and I indicated the date when and the models. Seems you have a problem reading.

 

[Geoff.D]

From my understanding, as long as the clutch paddle is pushed all the way in, there is pressure on the thrust/release bearing (not sure which is the more correct term- I think it's the same thing really). But i digress- not a mechanic either.

Also- I have some more questions. What is deemed as "low-power" output? And then- torque converter gearboxes- is it not true that the torque converter multiplies engine torque (some even by 3x) during acceleration/ when it's not in locked-up mode? So how come a torque converter box on a smaller powered car would then be a bad thing? I understand the reasoning as to why an AMT is a bad choice. But then I assume these small cars don't have torque converters? Sounds to me like smaller engine cars need all the help they can get.

Also, somewhere along the line Acura decided the world needs double-clutch torque-converter gearboxes. That sounds like something I want in my Honda.

I think you need to re-read your references. The multiplication effect is only during initial acceleration and rapidly decrease back to 1:1 as the vehicle speeds up.

 

[Splinter]

Drove both a manual and an automatic. Preferred the manual by far .......
Went with a friend who was in the market for one. In the end he went with the manual version.

No, the one I drove was a 6-speed manual. If it did have a blip function then I missed it, which is possible. Report on myBB somewhere might have been one of those, will have to look it up.
Makes no difference, I preferred the manual version to the automatic.

And if you read my reply properly you would have seen I drove an automatic also. and I indicated the date when and the models. Seems you have a problem reading.

I'm confused. Which is it?

 

[SykomantiS]

I think you need to re-read your references. The multiplication effect is only during initial acceleration and rapidly decrease back to 1:1 as the vehicle speeds up.

Well I did say during acceleration. I would have thought the effect would also be present during downshifting and accelerating. It's also the reason why I phrased it as a question and not a statement.

 

[Geoff.D]

I had a very good reference on torque converters which I need to go and find in my archives which explained why there is a limit below which torque converters do not work in terms of engine power and torque.

Also in my father's books in CT. there are complete Austin and Vauxhall workshop manuals (Mechanics manuals, not the typical ones sold to enthusiasts) where torque converters are fully described in great detail.

 

[Splinter]

I had a very good reference on torque converters which I need to go and find in my archives which explained why there is a limit below which torque converters do not work in terms of engine power and torque.

Before you go search your archives, I would appreciate you helping me as per my request above on post #494

 

[asshat99]

He is BSing about the double test drive. There is no way that after an M3 that anyone would think that an auto can downshift quickly. The story will change just like his street racing ultra double cab.

 

[Splinter]

He is BSing about the double test drive. There is no way that after an M3 that anyone would think that an auto can downshift quickly. The story will change just like his street racing ultra double cab.

Auto? Or you mean manual?

 

[asshat99]

Auto? Or you mean manual?

We will never know. Depends what suits him this time. Also remember his hilarious changing milage claims.

This is just the sad equivalent of 'I used to have to walk to and from school barefoot in the snow and it was uphill both ways!'. Sad.